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A few days ago I won an auction for a 7016 'Seiko Monaco' at a pretty good price, it arrived this morning (postman was banging on the door at 7.45am!) and i'm pretty much blown away .. though the movement isn't working (as per the seller's description), the watch itself is the nicest i've seen of its type, perfect crystal, very nice case with no major dents or scuffs, dial and hands in 100% condition..

So, a lull at work gave me some time to try and work out the value of what I had bought and I was looking through the Ebay sold listings and came to this NOS example which, apparently, has sold for a serious amount of money.

Here is the Ebay listing (ended, and posted for informative purposes only)
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/NOS-SEIKO-MONACO-7016-5011-DAY-DATE-BLUE-DIAL-STAINLESS-CHRONO-CHRONOGRAPH-WATCH-/131268605706

I can spot at least a dozen major problems with this supposedly NOS watch, I thought it would provide a good learning experience for some forummers that are new to this hobby to try and point out what's wrong :)

I'm posting some photos of my own 7016 as a reference ..

cheers, i'll chime in later with what defects I am seeing :)

Dave
 

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Chronograph hand is orange, not red and aren't aligned, rather scratched as well? I love the Seiko Chronographs, but spotting the fakes, bodged, damaged and pukka is really hard for me, there's so many different models and deviations. Hope I had 3 right answers?!?!?
Regards, David
 

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Nice Monaco you've got there Croolis!

Sure, saw that eBay listing go up. So sad that vintage watch buyers are being duped left right and centre, I'm sure it's been the same for years and I know it won't ever change - people keep on buying.....
 

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here's my list (keeping in mind the watch is supposed to be NOS)

- chrono seconds not resetting accurately to zero
- hour and minutes hands not correct
- crystal overpolished (rounded edges do not fit neatly to the case)
- wrong bracelet which is not seiko original
- wrong style of box (it's for an 80's model)
- top and bottom of the front case are bent (look from the rear view)
- case has been overpolished + rebrushed
- brush marks are uneven and not parallel
- crown is incorrect ( a bit too small, not centered )
- case lines have all but vanished (compare to my 7016-5000)

I'm sure the list is not exhaustive ..
I feel sorry for whoever paid $615 + shipping for this!
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Chronograph hand is orange, not red and aren't aligned, rather scratched as well? I love the Seiko Chronographs, but spotting the fakes, bodged, damaged and pukka is really hard for me, there's so many different models and deviations. Hope I had 3 right answers?!?!?
Regards, David
I think you're talking about mine (attached photos) and not the one I linked to on Ebay .. mine came very cheaply, and the description mostly said that it didn't work, and the case had a dent on the back. No problem at all there .. take a look at the one I put an Ebay link to - some poor soul paid $615 for that, the description and the watch absolutely do not match. It's a very good example of what to avoid.
 

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The hands are black in the eBay one you posted, yours are silver. I see now, yours is real, see how bad I am at spotting what is real? Hence I have no chronographs, and I really want a UFO. Didn't mean to offend you, sorry about my confusion. Glad you got a great watch, and you can fix the movement. Thanks for the lesson though, I learnt all about 6309 divers on here, and it helped immensely.
Regards, David
 

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Discussion Starter #7
Well, DPS, you're not the one who got suckered in by that particular chronograph, so you're already one up!

Chronographs aren't any different to any other vintage watch .. before committing yourself google the model, find out what it's meant to look like. Overpolishing, for example, can never be undone .. if one watch has a sharp edge, and another does not you can be quite sure that the one with the sharp edge is correct :)

The other thing to look carefully at is the description .. flowery prose might be entertaining but doesn't increase the value of the watch.

In this case, if the watch was really in NOS condition it would be easily worth $600 .. as is, I wouldn't pay more than $200 for it - and that's because it is meant to have a working 7016 which doesn't need a service and a nice dial.

Still time to get hooked on chronographs, or Seiko GS if you really don't like your bank account :)

The hands are black in the eBay one you posted, yours are silver. I see now, yours is real, see how bad I am at spotting what is real? Hence I have no chronographs, and I really want a UFO. Didn't mean to offend you, sorry about my confusion. Glad you got a great watch, and you can fix the movement. Thanks for the lesson though, I learnt all about 6309 divers on here, and it helped immensely.
Regards, David
 

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Bravo Dave !! :bowing:

here's my list (keeping in mind the watch is supposed to be NOS)

- chrono seconds not resetting accurately to zero
- hour and minutes hands not correct
- crystal overpolished (rounded edges do not fit neatly to the case)
- wrong bracelet which is not seiko original
- wrong style of box (it's for an 80's model)
- top and bottom of the front case are bent (look from the rear view)
- case has been overpolished + rebrushed
- brush marks are uneven and not parallel
- crown is incorrect ( a bit too small, not centered )
- case lines have all but vanished (compare to my 7016-5000)

I'm sure the list is not exhaustive ..
I feel sorry for whoever paid $615 + shipping for this!
 

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Just goes to show, if i had been offered that and given no chance to research it i would have thought i had a beauty but...............I would never really buy something like that without knowing a little about it :)

I have always fancied one of these models as a dress chronograph, very classy imo.
 
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