[ewand]

I've seen a growing number of dodgy sellers cropping up in Italy, it seems - like this one Silver horror show:
Seiko 6139 6002 Pogue Automatic Chronograph Stelux | eBay

seller is 20maryl20

Check out the (still current, id 184558353930) yellow Pogue with "Stelux bracelet":

Has someone got hold of a load of Stelux blades/clasps and are sticking them on AM bracelets, or are they actually fake engraving the STL blades too?

I wonder if that's a NOS short SEIKO clasp, with a long Stelux blade fitted to an AM bracelet?

 

[Time Seller]

swiss.japanese
Another jerk-off seller offering fakes claiming to be authentic AND uses shill bidding! Pile of !
AVOID at all costs!

 

[Yamaha]

Has anyone had any experience of an EBay seller 'Lukmek'. I'm a newbie and being cautious!

 

[ewand]

Has anyone had any experience of an EBay seller 'Lukmek'. I'm a newbie and being cautious!

yep, he's listed on the 1st post.

Example 6139 he's got on at the moment:

described as freshly serviced with a new pepsi bezel; no mention of the fake dial though. Or the fake case back.

... or the aftermarket bracelet...

 

[Yamaha]

Thank you for calling him out. I thought as much, but it’s nice to have an informed opinion.

 

[holonalu]

Any idea as to what it must cost to manufacture one of these replicas??? I just can't imagine where the profit would be, let alone the loss of ethics.

 

[Yamaha]

That's such a good point. It's not as though the caseback and other parts are completely rubbish or made from plastic etc. In a quieter moment earlier this week, I've had rather a humorous exchange with him and quite a few of the other 'fakers' and been offering them £100 (which I've said is a very generous offer) for their watches on the basis that it would be interesting to own and have in the hand so that I can refer to it for comparison when looking for a genuine watch.

 

[ewand]

This went for $987 the other day, though with private listing / bidders identities protected, it's impossible to know if it was shilled up or genuine. On the face of it, the dial is close but not quite there. Serif on 1, WATER 70M PROOF font is not quite right, no markers extending onto to subdial.

my_ukay_ukay from the Philippines

 

[byscott]

I don't normally call these out, but this seller just goes so far over the top ...

"This legend has been fully and comprehensively restored by a professional watchmaker. No stone left unturned and no expense has been spared.

The watch is running absolutely perfectly and so is the chronograph function, keeps very accurate time. The case has been mildly restored on the sides for a very sympathetic restoration, maintaining the all important sharp case lines and brushed/polish line contrast. Razor sharp lines all round. Mint condition overall, some minor marking on the underside, however it is still a 10/10. All functions are 100% and sub-dial and main chronograph hand reset to dead-on zero.

The genuine bezel has a new aluminium insert of the absolute best quality and the watch crystal is genuine and unmarked! All seals have been replaced to maintain water resistance.

The bracelet is absolutely amazing condition and comes with all spare links and pins.

The movement is all original and has been comprehensively serviced and lubricated with the best Swiss Moebius D5 Microgliss oil. The vertical clutch is strong and in brilliant shape with no signs of slip.

Yes, I am sure you can buy one from India for a bit less but it will be not even 1/10th the watch that this is. Watch has been properly sealed down with new gaskets against water, (and tested) but not guaranteed of course. The pictures speak for themselves. Study the pictures as they are the display of condition for you.

Cheapest minter on eBay by a long shot."

And he does mention the aftermarket "genuine" bezel insert. Too bad he neglects the fake dial (a really bad fake -6002 dial, no less!), the replacement sweep and sub-dial hands, aftermarket inner ring, what looks like an aftermarket crown, over polished case and caseback, and aftermarket bracelet. A "minter," indeed -- if that's a new synonym for "parts donor."

OTOH, he's only asking £620. In today's Fake Pogue market, that might be a bargain.

 

[A320]

I don't normally call these out, but this seller just goes so far over the top ...

"This legend has been fully and comprehensively restored by a professional watchmaker. No stone left unturned and no expense has been spared.

The watch is running absolutely perfectly and so is the chronograph function, keeps very accurate time. The case has been mildly restored on the sides for a very sympathetic restoration, maintaining the all important sharp case lines and brushed/polish line contrast. Razor sharp lines all round. Mint condition overall, some minor marking on the underside, however it is still a 10/10. All functions are 100% and sub-dial and main chronograph hand reset to dead-on zero.

The genuine bezel has a new aluminium insert of the absolute best quality and the watch crystal is genuine and unmarked! All seals have been replaced to maintain water resistance.

The bracelet is absolutely amazing condition and comes with all spare links and pins.

The movement is all original and has been comprehensively serviced and lubricated with the best Swiss Moebius D5 Microgliss oil. The vertical clutch is strong and in brilliant shape with no signs of slip.

Yes, I am sure you can buy one from India for a bit less but it will be not even 1/10th the watch that this is. Watch has been properly sealed down with new gaskets against water, (and tested) but not guaranteed of course. The pictures speak for themselves. Study the pictures as they are the display of condition for you.

Cheapest minter on eBay by a long shot."

And he does mention the aftermarket "genuine" bezel insert. Too bad he neglects the fake dial (a really bad fake -6002 dial, no less!), the replacement sweep and sub-dial hands, aftermarket inner ring, what looks like an aftermarket crown, over polished case and caseback, and aftermarket bracelet. A "minter," indeed -- if that's a new synonym for "parts donor."

OTOH, he's only asking £620. In today's Fake Pogue market, that might be a bargain.

View attachment 464433

View attachment 464434

So many things wrong. Pays to do your research. Hopefully nobody gets sucked in by their description.

Also, I don't think this is a shadow, but it looks like some overzealous polishing on the case here also.

 

[byscott]

Another recent eBay sale that gave me indigestion:

1977 Seiko Kakume 6138-0030 Speed-Timer vintage watch, serviced and working 100% | eBay

Auto winds great with a long power reserve and fully functioning chrono. A fully functioning watch, working just as it did. No parts have been swapped or changed or repaired or replaced.

www.ebay.com

All sorts of glowing verbiage about how great a watch this is. No mention of the wrong hour/minute hands, aftermarket sweep hand, or (oh, by the way) really crummy aftermarket dial.

When I see something like this I often wonder if the seller simply doesn’t realize that he’s flogging a pile of fake junk. But if he didn’t know, would his asking price be this far below market?

 

[Yamaha]

Another recent eBay sale that gave me indigestion:

http://[URL]https://www.ebay.com/it...-watch-serviced-and-working-100-/224360440717

[/URL]

All sorts of glowing verbiage about how great a watch this is. No mention of the wrong hour/minute hands, aftermarket sweep hand, or (oh, by the way) really crummy aftermarket dial.

When I see something like this I often wonder if the seller simply doesn’t realize that he’s flogging a pile of fake junk. But if he didn’t know, would his asking price be this far below market?

 

[Yamaha]

I think that you're being too kind, byscott! These people know what they're selling. I'm relatively new to this, but am already able to spot the obvious fakes/Franken watches. It's not just the photos themselves, but the language used to describe the watch. Less is more in many respects. I'm still no expert, but learning fast and still being very cautious.

 

[Time Seller]

deangelo1970, an Ebay seller from Italy who blatantly lies when he says his watches are "absolutely original", and makes big bucks from dumb buyers.
When confronted he denies his "items" are fake/aftermarket.
AVOID AT ALL COSTS!

Check out one of his "successful" auctions!

 

[Yamaha]

deangelo1970, an Ebay seller from Italy who lies when he says his watches are "absolutely original", and makes big bucks from dumb buyers.
When confronted he denies his "items" are fake/aftermarket.
AVOID AT ALL COSTS!

Surely it's just a coincidence that he's selling a second hand panda dial as well as an all original panda watch? 🤣

 

[Time Seller]

Surely it's just a coincidence that he's selling a second hand panda dial as well as an all original panda watch? 🤣

Ironically, the "destroyed" dial is probably the only genuine Panda dial he has.

 

[DAHASCO]

Ys-variety STAY AWAY from this ripoff artist !!!

 

[Yamaha]

Ys-variety STAY AWAY from this ripoff artist !!!

He's now removed the Panda dial after I sent his a rather sarcastic message!

Ironically, the "destroyed" dial is probably the only genuine Panda dial he has.

Funny. Deangelo1970 has blocked me from contacting him after I asked a perfectly reasonable question about the originality of the panda! He's taken down the old dial as well. I reported it to to Ebay as a potentially fraudulent listing. It'll be interesting to see what happens.

 

[Time Seller]

He's now removed the Panda dial after I sent his a rather sarcastic message!

Funny. Deangelo1970 has blocked me from contacting him after I asked a perfectly reasonable question about the originality of the panda! He's taken down the old dial as well. I reported it to to Ebay as a potentially fraudulent listing. It'll be interesting to see what happens.

Nothing will happen.
Back in December I wrote explaining that his dial was aftermarket (see his auction in my link above), initially hoping he might be honest and just not know. He wrote back belligerently and claimed my original was a fake, and that his was real. So, he's simply a cheating [email protected] And he's getting away with it.

 

[Yamaha]

Nothing will happen.
Back in December I wrote explaining that his dial was aftermarket (see his auction in my link above), initially hoping he might be honest and just not know. He wrote back belligerently and claimed my original was a fake, and that his was real. So, he's simply a cheating [email protected] And he's getting away with it.

Worth a try, though. There's more than one way to skin a cat.

Out of interest. I've just bought these. A 6139 8002 and a 6139 6010 and a couple of 6309 5030s. I'm new to this and you clearly know what you're talking about. Do the first two appear original to you? the 6309 5030s were bought as daily wearers and the first two I'll wear every now and then.