Very useful info for the engineering challenged, John. Here's a pdf version of a book I've had for donkey's years -the Presto tools counsellor (2013 copy)
Allen/Hex key for some Tuna shrouds.
Over the last couple of months i have been asked about Allen/Hex key sizes.
So just a little information about sizes.
So basically a 1.6mm key is within 0.0005" (five tenths/half a thou) of a 1/16" so for all intents and purposes 1.6mm is near enough the same as 1/16" imo, this information will/could save you hunting every were for a 1.6mm key
So just a little information about sizes.
- 1.5mm = 0.0591"(imperial)
- 1.6mm = 0.0630"(imperial).
- 1/16" = 0.0625(imperial).
So basically a 1.6mm key is within 0.0005" (five tenths/half a thou) of a 1/16" so for all intents and purposes 1.6mm is near enough the same as 1/16" imo, this information will/could save you hunting every were for a 1.6mm key
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Hi!
Recently I sent a few 1000 tunas for batt replacement. Three tunas that use allen/hex screws.
I'll pass along the experience I ran into with them...
My watchmaker had some tuff times to extract the screws without damage. In fact he wasn't able to.
After learning from the mistake of using an allen wrench of the flat head type, I got a solid advice from my friend Shannon Spence about tuna allen screws and the correct key type. In fact, Shannon's advice is worth its weight in gold!
Shannon tipped me off about the Bondhus allen screwdriver. Bondhus is the company that actually created the allen/hex screw, to begin with. So they know a thing or two about how to extract them without leaving any marks, no matter how tight they are (and the [email protected]$&*ers at Seiko know how to attach them tight!).
The Bondhus screwdriver has a ball, espheric head, so when one inserts it into the screw, the Bondhus tool gets snugly, juxtaposed fit inside the screw, so it allows for a great force transference into the screw upon extracting motion, without any spaces or play inside of it. And the fact that it has a ball end/head allows for a proper fitting inside the screw, thus preventing striping or marking the screw head.
The allen screws size used in the tunas (both SBBN015, SBBN017, SBBN011 and SBBN013, and also SBDX011) is exactly 1.5mm. A 1/16'' screwdriver won't fit inside the screw. Ask me how I know!
I've bought both sizes of the Bondhus screwdriver: 1.5mm and 1/16''. Only the 1.5mm fit inside the screw, but it was a 100% match, perfect fit of the exact type. The 1/16'' screwdriver didn't allow to reach full inside the screw head, where the ball end should sit snugly to allow proper torque motion in a way not to damage the screw.
The best part: you can buy a pair of Bondhus ball screwdrivers of 1.5mm on ebay, from a seller called omnitools (they sell stuff for aeromodelism), for around $4 usd a pair!
Not affiliated with the seller. Just spreading the news.
I can't thank my buddy Shannon enough for such golden tip as this.
Recently I sent a few 1000 tunas for batt replacement. Three tunas that use allen/hex screws.
I'll pass along the experience I ran into with them...
My watchmaker had some tuff times to extract the screws without damage. In fact he wasn't able to.
After learning from the mistake of using an allen wrench of the flat head type, I got a solid advice from my friend Shannon Spence about tuna allen screws and the correct key type. In fact, Shannon's advice is worth its weight in gold!
Shannon tipped me off about the Bondhus allen screwdriver. Bondhus is the company that actually created the allen/hex screw, to begin with. So they know a thing or two about how to extract them without leaving any marks, no matter how tight they are (and the [email protected]$&*ers at Seiko know how to attach them tight!
).The Bondhus screwdriver has a ball, espheric head, so when one inserts it into the screw, the Bondhus tool gets snugly, juxtaposed fit inside the screw, so it allows for a great force transference into the screw upon extracting motion, without any spaces or play inside of it. And the fact that it has a ball end/head allows for a proper fitting inside the screw, thus preventing striping or marking the screw head.
The allen screws size used in the tunas (both SBBN015, SBBN017, SBBN011 and SBBN013, and also SBDX011) is exactly 1.5mm. A 1/16'' screwdriver won't fit inside the screw. Ask me how I know!
I've bought both sizes of the Bondhus screwdriver: 1.5mm and 1/16''. Only the 1.5mm fit inside the screw, but it was a 100% match, perfect fit of the exact type. The 1/16'' screwdriver didn't allow to reach full inside the screw head, where the ball end should sit snugly to allow proper torque motion in a way not to damage the screw.
The best part: you can buy a pair of Bondhus ball screwdrivers of 1.5mm on ebay, from a seller called omnitools (they sell stuff for aeromodelism), for around $4 usd a pair!
Not affiliated with the seller. Just spreading the news.
I can't thank my buddy Shannon enough for such golden tip as this.
Two points to consider:
1) The Bondhus ball end allen screw-driver it's not an L-shaped tool. It is exactly like a regular screwdriver, with a handle to grip, thus making it easier to apply torque and not damage the screw by sliping the tool.
2) At first, my professional watchmaker (none other than an authorized facility for the Swatch Group brands, Audemars Piguet, Hublot and the likes, so they have experience with pretty much every type of watch and screw that is outhere) used just a regular 1.5mm L-shaped allen tool (flat head) to remove the screws. After a lot of carefull steps, some screws got totally stripped, specially the ones located at the bottom of the shroud, at the crown side (which got me very curious due to such coincidence).
I was forced to source the OEM brand new hex screws (in the package) for replacement, since a few of the original ones once installed in the watches were rendered totally useless.
So after learning my experience the hard way ($$$ !), and trying the Bondhus tool afterwards, I have finally found peace of mind next time those watches need to be opened, so I cannot stress enough to my fellow tuna collectors that own models which employ hex screws to invest a few dollars in a Bondhus 1.5mm ballhead driver.
Here is the Bondhus tool:
![]()
1) The Bondhus ball end allen screw-driver it's not an L-shaped tool. It is exactly like a regular screwdriver, with a handle to grip, thus making it easier to apply torque and not damage the screw by sliping the tool.
2) At first, my professional watchmaker (none other than an authorized facility for the Swatch Group brands, Audemars Piguet, Hublot and the likes, so they have experience with pretty much every type of watch and screw that is outhere) used just a regular 1.5mm L-shaped allen tool (flat head) to remove the screws. After a lot of carefull steps, some screws got totally stripped, specially the ones located at the bottom of the shroud, at the crown side (which got me very curious due to such coincidence).
I was forced to source the OEM brand new hex screws (in the package) for replacement, since a few of the original ones once installed in the watches were rendered totally useless.
So after learning my experience the hard way ($$$ !), and trying the Bondhus tool afterwards, I have finally found peace of mind next time those watches need to be opened, so I cannot stress enough to my fellow tuna collectors that own models which employ hex screws to invest a few dollars in a Bondhus 1.5mm ballhead driver.
Here is the Bondhus tool:
One of the best piece of advices ever given here. I can stress enough how much I agree with you on every word, brother.
I'm a firm believer that Seiko applies thread locker to those fuckers, upon fastening them in the factory. Upon removal, all of my screws came out with a ****** goo, totally dry, on the thread portion.
I can't understand the real need to apply thread locker on a screw located in a part that won't see any play, movement or vibration. It only makes our life a living hell.
And it is not so much the need of applying force on the screws to back them out...the difficult part here is how to extract them without causing damage to them, cosmetically and also functionally.
The Bondhus has its weight worth in gold. Mark my words.
don't want to sound negative, but...
original Tunas have " + " screw heads. Anything after that is just a fake
about the glue inside, I bet this is typical Japanese stuff: "we at Seiko make the watches, we screw the shrouds on tighter than anybody else can AND we can unscrew and screw them back in place as we please"... and all other people messing with our watches should pay the price.
I LOVE the Japanese --or rather I should say I have unlimited respect for their achievements in engineering, traditional arts and crafts, etc. but they tend to be pretty arrogant about those very qualities, and certainly have no great love for foreigners ("gaijin" and among them more specifically those hailing from the USofA?) so I wouldn't be at all surprised that they glue the #$%&ers in so tight just to make you guys' life difficult
original Tunas have " + " screw heads. Anything after that is just a fake
about the glue inside, I bet this is typical Japanese stuff: "we at Seiko make the watches, we screw the shrouds on tighter than anybody else can AND we can unscrew and screw them back in place as we please"... and all other people messing with our watches should pay the price.
I LOVE the Japanese --or rather I should say I have unlimited respect for their achievements in engineering, traditional arts and crafts, etc. but they tend to be pretty arrogant about those very qualities, and certainly have no great love for foreigners ("gaijin" and among them more specifically those hailing from the USofA?) so I wouldn't be at all surprised that they glue the #$%&ers in so tight just to make you guys' life difficult
Only if you clarify "original" to mean the first tunas - with Ti screws, as the later ones are also totally original and don't have "+" heads or Ti screws.original Tunas have " + " screw heads. Anything after that is just a fake
about the glue inside, I bet this is typical Japanese stuff: "we at Seiko make the watches, we screw the shrouds on tighter than anybody else can AND we can unscrew and screw them back in place as we please"... and all other people messing with our watches should pay the price.
I LOVE the Japanese --or rather I should say I have unlimited respect for their achievements in engineering, traditional arts and crafts, etc. but they tend to be pretty arrogant about those very qualities, and certainly have no great love for foreigners ("gaijin" and among them more specifically those hailing from the USofA?) so I wouldn't be at all surprised that they glue the #$%&ers in so tight just to make you guys' life difficult
These watches were originally designed to be serviced by Seiko factory only, and they managed to work on them successfully- obviously using the correct tools and techniques, so what is the problem??
I don't think your assessment of the Japanese people's lack of love for foreigners or thier arrogance is really appropriate or necessary -whether or not you believe it to be true, this is an international forum and we shouldn't be perpetuating racial stereotyping -especially if you claim to "love" the Japanese.
Unless you have this guy's job and wears a tuna while at it, then there's no need to use a thread locker to a non-moving part screws, IMHO.
Have you been following the developments in the Swiss watch industry lately? I'll leave it at that.original Tunas have " + " screw heads. Anything after that is just a fake
about the glue inside, I bet this is typical Japanese stuff: "we at Seiko make the watches, we screw the shrouds on tighter than anybody else can AND we can unscrew and screw them back in place as we please"... and all other people messing with our watches should pay the price.
I LOVE the Japanese --or rather I should say I have unlimited respect for their achievements in engineering, traditional arts and crafts, etc. but they tend to be pretty arrogant about those very qualities, and certainly have no great love for foreigners ("gaijin" and among them more specifically those hailing from the USofA?) so I wouldn't be at all surprised that they glue the #$%&ers in so tight just to make you guys' life difficult
I don't think you know any Japanese people, or if you do you don't know them very well. A lot Japanese are fascinated with French and American culture, especially their idea of the Californian beach lifestyle. (I'm married to one).
Sorry guys. Back to the topic at hand.
2
relax...
I thought smileys
![]()
were used to signal a joke or otherwise deliberate "overstatement", etc.
For those of you who thought my criticism of the "Japanese" (lumping one people in one single lot being wrong in the first place anyway) was "out of order" or downright racist, I will just signal that I am half-Japanese myself, my wife is Japanese, therefore over half of my family and many of my friends are Japanese... and if that were not enough I work daily with Japanese colleagues, in Japanese language, etc.
...but then I am also partly French and therefore feel quite free to criticize the French for their arrogance, stupidity, cultural superiority complex and MANY OTHER QUALITIES --all good fun...
As for the "Americans", the Latin American part of me (the part that spent spent some time living in Buenos Aires) thinks they're all YANQUIS
![]()
BACK TO TUNA SHROUD SCREWS: I agree 200% fully with Chris
With shared love of Seikos, admiration for ALL things Japanese and strong interest for inter-cultural exchanges all in good fun hopefully........Philip
I thought smileys
For those of you who thought my criticism of the "Japanese" (lumping one people in one single lot being wrong in the first place anyway) was "out of order" or downright racist, I will just signal that I am half-Japanese myself, my wife is Japanese, therefore over half of my family and many of my friends are Japanese... and if that were not enough I work daily with Japanese colleagues, in Japanese language, etc.
...but then I am also partly French and therefore feel quite free to criticize the French for their arrogance, stupidity, cultural superiority complex and MANY OTHER QUALITIES --all good fun...
As for the "Americans", the Latin American part of me (the part that spent spent some time living in Buenos Aires) thinks they're all YANQUIS
BACK TO TUNA SHROUD SCREWS: I agree 200% fully with Chris
"+" screws protruding out of the classical Tuna shrouds are cool, beautiful, simple, unassuming, practical, resistant... why change to Allen/hex???
With shared love of Seikos, admiration for ALL things Japanese and strong interest for inter-cultural exchanges all in good fun hopefully........Philip
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