Very useful info for the engineering challenged, John. Here's a pdf version of a book I've had for donkey's years -the Presto tools counsellor (2013 copy)
I agree with Barry, the ball end is really for use when you can't get the correct alignment to the head of the screw/caphead and for this application the ball end is perfect but when you can align correctly you would use the hex end as there would be more of the faces in contact.Just a note regards the ball ends. These are designed to allow faster removal of the screw/bolt and slight angular misalignment between the allen key and bolt axis is permitted (due to the ball). However, for high torque applications (ie when the screw is tight) the balls are not recommended. This is because the contact points of the ball in the screw socket is obviously smaller that a non ball end - where flats contact against flat surface.
If you look, you will see that the balls are only on the long sides of the allen keys. This is deliberate. If the long side is in the socket, then it leaves the short side out for leverage. And short side gives lower leverage that the long.
As Archimedes once said - give me a lever long enough and i will move the World. The converse is also true
One of the best piece of advices ever given here. I can stress enough how much I agree with you on every word, brother.I've removed a few of these on various Tunas and Sawtooths and I've stripped a few heads doing so. I used 1.5mm allen keys too. The thing I've come to find is that not all 1.5mm allen keys are alike. As with anything manufactured, they are built to different tollerances and some fit snugger than others.
Do yourself a favour and buy only high quality tools. Don't use the one that came with your IKEA furniture. This will help alleviate the problem considerably. And if you buy a 1.5mm Allen key and it doesn't fit snuggly, DON'T USE IT. You will strip the head. Find one that fits snuggly.
Only if you clarify "original" to mean the first tunas - with Ti screws, as the later ones are also totally original and don't have "+" heads or Ti screws.original Tunas have " + " screw heads. Anything after that is just a fake
about the glue inside, I bet this is typical Japanese stuff: "we at Seiko make the watches, we screw the shrouds on tighter than anybody else can AND we can unscrew and screw them back in place as we please"... and all other people messing with our watches should pay the price.
I LOVE the Japanese --or rather I should say I have unlimited respect for their achievements in engineering, traditional arts and crafts, etc. but they tend to be pretty arrogant about those very qualities, and certainly have no great love for foreigners ("gaijin" and among them more specifically those hailing from the USofA?) so I wouldn't be at all surprised that they glue the #$%&ers in so tight just to make you guys' life difficult![]()
Hear, hear. No watch company is obligated to make their product simple to work on by anyone without proper training and brand-specific information. Thread-adhesives are commonplace in the watch industry because the relative tightening torques that small fasteners can withstand are not always matched by the forces they experience day after day, year after year. Small repetitive movements and vibrations add up!These watches were originally designed to be serviced by Seiko factory only, and they managed to work on them successfully- obviously using the correct tools and techniques, so what is the problem??
I don't think your assessment of the Japanese people's lack of love for foreigners or thier arrogance is really appropriate or necessary -whether or not you believe it to be true, this is an international forum and we shouldn't be perpetuating racial stereotyping -especially if you claim to "love" the Japanese.
They do it with the correct tool, that's all. Once I was finally able to locate the correct tool, never a problem again to unscrew the screws.Here, here. No watch company is obligated to make their product simple to work on by anyone without proper training and brand-specific information. Thread-adhesives are commonplace in the watch industry because the relative tightening torques that small fasteners can withstand are not always matched by the forces they experience day after day, year after year. Small repetitive movements and vibrations add up!
I'm sure we can all agree that it would be great to see how the factory properly does it!
Unless you have this guy's job and wears a tuna while at it, then there's no need to use a thread locker to a non-moving part screws, IMHO.Thread-adhesives are commonplace in the watch industry because the relative tightening torques that small fasteners can withstand are not always matched by the forces they experience day after day, year after year. Small repetitive movements and vibrations add up!
Have you been following the developments in the Swiss watch industry lately? I'll leave it at that.original Tunas have " + " screw heads. Anything after that is just a fake
about the glue inside, I bet this is typical Japanese stuff: "we at Seiko make the watches, we screw the shrouds on tighter than anybody else can AND we can unscrew and screw them back in place as we please"... and all other people messing with our watches should pay the price.
I LOVE the Japanese --or rather I should say I have unlimited respect for their achievements in engineering, traditional arts and crafts, etc. but they tend to be pretty arrogant about those very qualities, and certainly have no great love for foreigners ("gaijin" and among them more specifically those hailing from the USofA?) so I wouldn't be at all surprised that they glue the #$%&ers in so tight just to make you guys' life difficult![]()
"+" screws protruding out of the classical Tuna shrouds are cool, beautiful, simple, unassuming, practical, resistant... why change to Allen/hex???I also think that the old tunas with the "+" screw were much more damage proof than this prone to stripping allen screw, and then once again it is inevitable to call out on the "tool aspect" of the watch with such a poor choice in a non-functional screw type. I tend to believe that in this instance, Seiko went for the cosmetical aspect first, leaving the practical or functional aspect to second place.