Part #12 : Remove hands, dial, day and date wheels - Seiko & Citizen Watch Forum – Japanese Watch Reviews, Discussion & Trading
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Old 09-30-2010, 08:34 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Default Part #12 : Remove hands, dial, day and date wheels

“Project” 6309 !!
Hand, dial, day & date wheels.


How to remove the hands, dial, day and date wheels.

.
· Tools needed, tweezers, finger cots, movement holder, 1mm & 1.2mm screwdrivers, dial protectors and I always save any old crystals I remove for holding small parts in them and I find having a micro cloth underneath were I am working is handy for if I drop anything as it doesn’t bounce and disappear.


· After placing the movement in the holder I always wind the hands to the 12 position no reason just seems the logical thing to do.


· Then I cover the dial with the Bergeon protector ready to lever the hands off, I now always tend to use the levers rather than a puller and remove each hand separately, when you lever them off use equal pressure either side and be gentle or else you could send the hand in to orbit or cause some damage.

· Once the hands are removed you can remove the dial from the movement, If you turn it on to its side you will see two screws holding the dial one is at 11.45 and the other at 6.30, unscrew these and then the dial will lift straight off along with the dial ring.

· Now the dial has gone you can get to the day wheel this is held in place by the “C” washer again I use the hand levers to remove this once again do it gently and evenly so that you don’t strain it or bend it. You will notice that when you have removed the “C” washer one side of it is flat and one side is convex, it is important when replacing this you place the flat side up towards the dial, the day wheel will now just lift off of the movement.

· To remove the date wheel I just remove the one screw on the cover and slide the date wheel off the movement.
This is a very nice original dial and the hands are not bad either and I have decided to send them off to Bry to be relumed as I was impressed with the sample of his work he sent me.















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Old 09-30-2010, 09:05 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Default Re: Part #12 : Remove hands, dial, day and date wheels

Hi John and all,
That is a very good post all around. I like that you've decided on levers as opposed to pullers- it shows careful thought on how the tools one uses can affect the watch negatively, and levers tend to lessen that possibility more so than pullers. This is my opinion, and also that of any major watch manufacturer interested in maintaining a perfect appearance of their product. I imagine that pullers can be successfully used without causing a mark on the dial and/or hands, but the learning curve is much steeper, and the feel just cannot be compared to levers. It is more difficult to feel what the tool is doing with pullers as opposed to levers.

Securing movements in the dial-up position in a traditional movement holder can be difficult, causing slips if not careful. Also, the balance is dangerously exposed if care is not taken as to where the movement holder's posts are positioned. For this reason, it is safer to use a casing cushion, like the one in my last photo below. A movement holder that contacts only the outside circumference is even better as it is more secure, but these are expensive to get for every size one would encounter. Two examples are here:

(photo from Cas-ker material house, this type does not hold the movement tightly, it is more so used for setting hands)

and here:

(photo from here, not the right size for 6309, but you get the idea)

One tip I'd add is my favorite way to remove the day disc's "C" clip. It is difficult to pry it up and off without scratching it or the fragile disc underneath, and a burr at this spot can cause problems in smooth rotation. To avoid all of this (and launching it to the last place I'd ever look), I wedge a well-dressed .80mm screw driver blade into the opening of the "C"- this spreads the "C" just enough to lift it straight up and off, still clinging to the screwdriver blade. Here it is being brought into the slot, before rotating into the ends of the "C". As long as no downward pressure is applied to the day disc underneath, it is a clean and easy way to remove the "C" clip. Some other Seiko calibers with C clips will also work with the .80 screwdriver, but not all. The 61's and 63's are a good fit though.
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Old 09-30-2010, 09:15 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Default Re: Part #12 : Remove hands, dial, day and date wheels

Thanks Noah that is a good tip with the .8 screw driver for removing the "C" washer.

I have been looking at those movement holders you have shown and i feel they would be better that the Bergeon 4040, what size are they for the 6XXX series ?
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Old 10-01-2010, 06:42 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Default Re: Part #12 : Remove hands, dial, day and date wheels

For those of us using Presto style lifter, could you explain how we use it (mechanically I understand, just any tips and tricks, etc.)


If our date wheel is working correctly, is it necessary to remove it (i.e. will we be cleaning or replacing any parts beneath it). I understand why you're posting it, I'm just not sure that this is the watch I want to practice this on if it's not necessary.


If you look at my photos, my hands show wear and pitting. Is there anything I can do about this? Is the only option to replace them with aftermarket hands of the same design? I've read that replacement hands can be poorly made (pressed out of the sheet metal). Do you have a source for these hands that are well made? (I haven't seen any on Yobokies site, for example [I mean replacements, not poor quality ones.) Do we have to go OEM?


Will you be reluming the dial also? I have wondered what relumed hands will look like with an unrelumed dial, and if they are any use without hour markers.


Questions questions questions. All I have are questions. If you want my tricks and tips, come back to me in about ten years.
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Old 10-01-2010, 07:17 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Default Re: Part #12 : Remove hands, dial, day and date wheels

Hi Ben,
There is no need to move the day or date wheels if you have no problems, just letting you know what is there and how to remove them, my project watch is going to have a kanji day wheel.

If you are using the pullers then i recommend that you still use the dial protectors and again when you have the puller in position squeeze it gentle, i have often found that the hour hand on these sits very close to the dial thats why i started to use the levers in stead.

The flat after market hands are in fact quite good IMO, the hands are easy to clean up and relume and even if the dial isent redone they look ok but obviously you notice more when your in poor light and the hands are glowing and the dial is dead, so on this one I have sent it to Bry to relume hands and dial it will be my first 6309 that has been relumed , i will post a picture when done.

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Old 10-02-2010, 07:05 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Default Re: Part #12 : Remove hands, dial, day and date wheels

Another great post, John!

I was waiting for this part to dig in my 6309-7040, as the main mod I want to do is to install new hands!
Cheers,
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Old 10-03-2010, 08:31 AM   #7 (permalink)
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Default Re: Part #12 : Remove hands, dial, day and date wheels

With regard the pullers, are we removing hands individually, or all in one explosive bundle?
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Old 10-03-2010, 08:55 AM   #8 (permalink)
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Default Re: Part #12 : Remove hands, dial, day and date wheels

Quote:
Originally Posted by lalanda
With regard the pullers, are we removing hands individually, or all in one explosive bundle?
With the pullers all three come off at once but i have in the past when using the pullers removed the second hand first before the "explosion" so hopefully preventing any chance of it getting damaged.

I do find though on the divers the levers are better (JMO).
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Old 10-04-2010, 02:43 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Default Re: Part #12 : Remove hands, dial, day and date wheels

hello all,
so what tools will we be using to put all this back? i only ask because someone mentioned using an oiler to get the day wheel back on. i'd just like to know cause i don't have one and i'd have to order one, or which ever tool you will use/need to move the day jumper out of the way.
sorry for the impatience, and thanks for your time
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Old 10-04-2010, 03:22 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Default Re: Part #12 : Remove hands, dial, day and date wheels

Quote:
Originally Posted by se7en8n9ne
hello all,
so what tools will we be using to put all this back? i only ask because someone mentioned using an oiler to get the day wheel back on. i'd just like to know cause i don't have one and i'd have to order one, or which ever tool you will use/need to move the day jumper out of the way.
sorry for the impatience, and thanks for your time
A cocktail stick will do, i use a needle in a pin vice.
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Old 10-04-2010, 04:27 PM   #11 (permalink)
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Default Re: Part #12 : Remove hands, dial, day and date wheels

thats great my better half has plenty of needles. i look forward to that part alot.

thanks for your time
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Old 10-17-2010, 05:09 PM   #12 (permalink)
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Default Re: Part #12 : Remove hands, dial, day and date wheels

Anyone else have any problem getting presto jaws under the hour hand? They're Bergeon, so they should be well made.


I've learned that hands from any Seiko automatic will fit on any other automatic, but how about date wheels? I mean, how similar are they?
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Old 10-17-2010, 05:28 PM   #13 (permalink)
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Default Re: Part #12 : Remove hands, dial, day and date wheels

Quote:
Originally Posted by lalanda
Anyone else have any problem getting presto jaws under the hour hand? They're Bergeon, so they should be well made.


I've learned that hands from any Seiko automatic will fit on any other automatic, but how about date wheels? I mean, how similar are they?
I have found that for some reason there is very limited room under the hour hand on the divers (unlike a 4006) and thats one of the reasons i use the levers now adays.

Most (or all) 6XXX series models date wheels are interchangeable as long as the crown is in the correct position between the two models.
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