Project Restoration/Build - 1970 7017-6010 Speedtimer JDM Proof - Seiko & Citizen Watch Forum Ė Japanese Watch Reviews, Discussion & Trading
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 03-07-2019, 07:33 AM   #1 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
Vette Enthusiast's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2019
Location: NOVA
Posts: 169
Points: 6 (+)
Default Project Restoration/Build - 1970 7017-6010 Speedtimer JDM Proof

I wanted to update you all on my latest project build of my recently acquired 7017-6010 Speedtimer, a first for me. I am fairly new to this forum and I appreciate some of the more seasoned members helping me out with answers to my questions. Your guidance has been invaluable.

The watch was a pickup from eBay from a Japanese seller who stated the watch ran well but had a slow return button. I figured that was just sticky seals and took a gamble and purchased the watch. The bracelet is from a recent project I completed on a 79 Seiko 6319-6000 and believe it or not the end links fit the Speedtimer perfectly. The clasp says Seiko Speedtimer but is off of a 6138 Bullhead bracelet I have sitting around that is pretty much junk. Case lines were good and brushing intact. Case was lightly refinished and new crystal installed courtesy of Spencer Klein of Klein Vintage Watch Repair. He had a NOS crystal he was kind enough to sell it to me for this project. The inner rotating bezel is in decent condition but the lume pip at the top was deteriorating and I feared it would flake off onto the dial unless I stabilized it so I went ahead and put some new lume over the top of it.

The watch is completely disassembled, cleaned and ready to go back together. This movement has two jewel settings on the winding bridge that I had to remove clean, oil and reinstall. I ran into one issue with the center wheel bridge. As you can see in the pic there is a jewel bushing that appears cracked and damaged. The damage was minor and I thought about taking this to my watchmaker to have him install a new bushing, but I was able to source a brand new bridge from a seller on eBay. Believe it or not, the most difficult part thus far for me was servicing the mainspring. This is a split type barrel and I finally figured out I could take a very sharp knife and work around the edge were the two halves come together. Once I figured that out, I set about servicing the mainspring. Having worked on a 6106 and 6319 I figured I would wind the spring and install the same way. Wrong. Turns out I installed the spring upside down, not once but twice before getting it right. Glad I drew a picture. I had to pull out my entire arsenal of tools on this build not to mention purchasing an S-510 movement holder from VTM just to reinstall the chrono hand. More updates to follow once my parts arrive. Thanks for looking.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg IMG_0025.jpg (296.9 KB, 32 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_0024.jpg (154.1 KB, 36 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_0023.jpg (166.2 KB, 35 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_0009.jpg (227.9 KB, 39 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_0008.jpg (245.0 KB, 38 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_0001.jpg (279.4 KB, 37 views)

Last edited by Vette Enthusiast; 03-07-2019 at 12:10 PM.
Vette Enthusiast is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old 03-07-2019, 12:27 PM   #2 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
Vette Enthusiast's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2019
Location: NOVA
Posts: 169
Points: 6 (+)
Default

Quick pic of the dial. Remarkable condition for its age.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg IMG_0026.jpg (138.1 KB, 34 views)
__________________
____________
--John S.--
Vette Enthusiast is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 03-07-2019, 12:52 PM   #3 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
GuyJ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: North East
Posts: 6,918
Points: 300 (+)
Default

Looking good! Keep updating as you go.
GuyJ is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old 03-07-2019, 03:16 PM   #4 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
Grammarofdesign's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: US of A
Posts: 4,285
Points: 178 (+)
Default

My 7017-6010. These are a tad larger than a Pouge, have that similar iinner rotating ring, flyback sweeper but no subdial.

Can't wait to see your finished project looks like it will be a very special specimen!
Grammarofdesign is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 03-07-2019, 11:37 PM   #5 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Auckland, New Zealand
Posts: 2,554
Points: 36 (+)
Default

Good work
I applaud your efforts.
__________________
Paul ;-)
nzwatchdoctor is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 03-08-2019, 10:52 PM   #6 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
Vette Enthusiast's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2019
Location: NOVA
Posts: 169
Points: 6 (+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Grammarofdesign View Post
My 7017-6010. These are a tad larger than a Pouge, have that similar iinner rotating ring, flyback sweeper but no subdial.

Can't wait to see your finished project looks like it will be a very special specimen!
Amazing looking piece. Makes me want to finish mine. Thanks for sharing.
__________________
____________
--John S.--
Vette Enthusiast is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 03-09-2019, 03:51 AM   #7 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2018
Posts: 199
Points: 19 (+)
Default

Really interesting stuff. It was your posts regarding your 6319-6000 project that got me looking at this style of diver and seeking out a 7019-6000 for myself.

Looking forward to the next installment.

Cheers

Gavin
gtmoore99 is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 03-21-2019, 07:22 AM   #8 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
Vette Enthusiast's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2019
Location: NOVA
Posts: 169
Points: 6 (+)
Default

Update - Well my parts finally arrived thanks to Seikolady over in Israel. Brand new center wheel bridge and a mainspring barrel and spring for a cal 7016. I was somewhat suspect of my serviced mainspring as I struggled to get the spring wound in and in the barrel in the correct orientation. Took me 3 tries and by the end the spring was not sitting exactly flat on the bench. Problem with the 7016 replacement is that although the barrel is the same the arbor is a bit longer. I decided to put my serviced barrel and mainspring in which may have not been the right choice as you will see. Put the motion works side of the movement together over the past couple of nights. Had a hell of a time getting the upper train bridge installed and sitting correctly with escape wheel and 3rd wheel pivots in their jewel settings. I must have messed with it for about an hour. Finally had to take a small oiler and go under and manipulate the escape wheel pivot into position. Also had some difficulty with the balance assembly upon first install as the watch did not want to run. Checked everything and reinstalled the pallet fork again to make sure it was seated properly. Finally got it going but the beat error was way off the charts which may have been why the watch did not want to initially run. I do not think the impulse jewel was in position to move the pallet fork. Got it all dialed in on the time grapher but the disappointment is my amplitude is low running just over 200. I was meticulous about my cleaning and oiling and the jewel settings. I am suspect of the barrel and spring and I plan to pull the movement apart again and start over. I will swap the arbor over to the new mainspring and see if I get better results. Any other ideas are appreciated. I feel good about getting it pulled apart and back together but big disappointment on the numbers. Thanks for looking.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg IMG_0049.jpg (121.8 KB, 27 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_0050.jpg (51.5 KB, 26 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_0048.jpg (51.4 KB, 27 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_0040.jpg (52.1 KB, 28 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_0038.jpg (58.0 KB, 28 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_0037.jpg (54.7 KB, 24 views)
__________________
____________
--John S.--

Last edited by Vette Enthusiast; 03-21-2019 at 07:45 AM.
Vette Enthusiast is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 03-21-2019, 07:28 AM   #9 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
Grammarofdesign's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: US of A
Posts: 4,285
Points: 178 (+)
Default

Wishing you success. If you called it a wrap right now you could still wear it well.
Grammarofdesign is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 03-21-2019, 08:01 AM   #10 (permalink)
Member
 
MDNTRDR's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2019
Posts: 46
Points: 0 (+)
Default

Don't lose heart. Setting a good example. The write up and pictures are very helpful for people still learning. You'll have a super cool vintage watch that runs brand new. Very cool thread and very much appreciated.
MDNTRDR is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 03-21-2019, 08:08 PM   #11 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
mwadner's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Metro Seattle
Posts: 5,343
Points: 311 (+)
Default

you're doing a great job and no doubt learning tons about this. If it was easy anyone could do it. 7017s are among my favorite movements/watches and I'm following this thread closely.

thanks for your time to post progress and challenges. Much appreciated.
__________________
There's what people want to hear, there's what people want to believe, there's everything else, then there's the truth Ö. (from "The International")
mwadner is online now   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 03-22-2019, 06:33 AM   #12 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
SeikoPsycho2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: NE PA
Posts: 3,054
Points: 87 (+)
Default

Remember, you're working with a 50 year old watch which has wear throughout. Was the main spring fully wound manually? Did you let it run for a several hours before taking your readings?
Along with switching the old arbor over to the new barrel assy, I would check for wear in the barrel arbor ports in the plates. I would also make sure the pallet arbors aren't lubed and that too much oil wasn't added to the balance cap jewels.
__________________
Too Many Watches - Not Enough Time...

Gracefully Delivered from Delusions..........

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EjcsMZRXqCc

PhotoScumBucket Fix for Firefox
https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/fir...obucket-fixer/
And for Google Chrome
https://chrome.google.com/webstore/d...giikdkpmcpkaon
SeikoPsycho2 is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 03-22-2019, 12:04 PM   #13 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
Vette Enthusiast's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2019
Location: NOVA
Posts: 169
Points: 6 (+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by SeikoPsycho2 View Post
Remember, you're working with a 50 year old watch which has wear throughout. Was the main spring fully wound manually? Did you let it run for a several hours before taking your readings?
Along with switching the old arbor over to the new barrel assy, I would check for wear in the barrel arbor ports in the plates. I would also make sure the pallet arbors aren't lubed and that too much oil wasn't added to the balance cap jewels.
Thanks. I did fully wind the mainspring manually. I was very careful with the oiling of the balance cap jewels. I think I was pretty spot on there. I used Moebius 9415 on the ends of the pallet jewels applying just the smallest amount I could under 10x mag. It is much thicker than 9010. I am thinking I might go back to 9010 this go around to see if this makes any difference. Did not lubricate the pallet jewel pivots. My readings were just after the watch was put to running. I did check it the following morning and the numbers were about the same. Lower mainspring arbor port looks really good. I did not see any brassing or ovaling of the port. Thanks for the input.
__________________
____________
--John S.--
Vette Enthusiast is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 03-22-2019, 11:12 PM   #14 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Auckland, New Zealand
Posts: 2,554
Points: 36 (+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vette Enthusiast View Post
Thanks. I did fully wind the mainspring manually. I was very careful with the oiling of the balance cap jewels. I think I was pretty spot on there. I used Moebius 9415 on the ends of the pallet jewels applying just the smallest amount I could under 10x mag. It is much thicker than 9010. I am thinking I might go back to 9010 this go around to see if this makes any difference. Did not lubricate the pallet jewel pivots. My readings were just after the watch was put to running. I did check it the following morning and the numbers were about the same. Lower mainspring arbor port looks really good. I did not see any brassing or ovaling of the port. Thanks for the input.



I always rub the cap jewels (flat side obviously) on paper to clean them. If you haven't then you could try that.
The mainsprings in them are so good if they're not broken, look in good shape and are clean....they're as good as new anyway.
__________________
Paul ;-)
nzwatchdoctor is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 03-23-2019, 06:05 AM   #15 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
Vette Enthusiast's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2019
Location: NOVA
Posts: 169
Points: 6 (+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by nzwatchdoctor View Post
I always rub the cap jewels (flat side obviously) on paper to clean them. If you haven't then you could try that.
The mainsprings in them are so good if they're not broken, look in good shape and are clean....they're as good as new anyway.
Thanks Paul. I cleaned both the diashock and cap jewels using lighter fluid and watchmakers paper rubbing the flat side to remove the old oil and dirt. I did clean the original mainspring but had some issues reinstalling it in the barrel and in the end it was not laying quite flat on the bench. It works but it is weaker than the new spring I put in. I typically try to clean and reuse the original spring when I can, but in this case it was best to replace. More to follow.
__________________
____________
--John S.--
Vette Enthusiast is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 03-23-2019, 12:46 PM   #16 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
Vette Enthusiast's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2019
Location: NOVA
Posts: 169
Points: 6 (+)
Default

Well folks I have into a bit of a major issue. Seems, when I engage the chrono wheel to run the second hand the watch comes to a stop. I was very careful with the chrono wheel on disassembly and assembly. This occurred after my second rebuild. I have done some investigating and the train of gears will free wheel by moving the barrel assembly when the chrono clutch is in the open position. When I press the start button at 2 o'clock the clutch on the chrono wheel drops to the closed position and the gear train stops. I tried moving the gears with my brass tweezer by moving the winding barrel and it is like the gear train is bound up. If I bump it back and forth gently I can get the gears to fee wheel a bit and sometime it will free wheel for about 3/4 turn and I can see the Chrono second hand pinion moving on the other side the main plate but then binds up again. I did oil the second hand pinion as described in the tech guide before inserting it into the center wheel pinion and it did not look to be bent as it dropped in.

I suspect a bad chrono wheel. The one thing I did was ultrasonic clean the chrono wheel in lighter fluid and maybe that was my error. Any thoughts on possible solutions outside of sourcing a new chrono wheel are appreciated. The watch worked fine when I received it so I must have done something wrong or the chrono wheel just gave up the ghost. Pretty disappointing.

Update - I just figured out my issue. On a whim I looked at the parts list for cal 7017A to get the chrono wheel part number as there are two different wheels depending on date the watch was manufactured. In the note, it stated each wheel is combined with a certain center wheel bridge and mainspring barrel. Recall, I swapped in a barrel and spring for a cal 7016 which I thought was the same except for the barrel arbor. I think the 7016 barrel is slight taller on center as I noted a spacer used on cal 7016 just below the chrono bridge. I did use a set of calipers to measure the barrel width and height at outer ends but not on center other than to note the barrel arbors were different heights.

Next, I loosened the upper train bridge screws slightly on the side near the mainspring barrel and voila, the chrono wheel works with clutch engaged and disengaged and the gear train free wheels nicely in both setting. Tighten down on the upper train bridge screws and and same binding issue.

Back to square one. I need to pull the motion side apart, clean, and this time swap back in the old mainspring barrel. Lesson learned. Barrel assembly for cal 7016 will not work in cal 7017.
__________________
____________
--John S.--

Last edited by Vette Enthusiast; 03-23-2019 at 01:14 PM.
Vette Enthusiast is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 03-23-2019, 01:45 PM   #17 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Auckland, New Zealand
Posts: 2,554
Points: 36 (+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vette Enthusiast View Post
Well folks I have into a bit of a major issue. Seems, when I engage the chrono wheel to run the second hand the watch comes to a stop. I was very careful with the chrono wheel on disassembly and assembly. This occurred after my second rebuild. I have done some investigating and the train of gears will free wheel by moving the barrel assembly when the chrono clutch is in the open position. When I press the start button at 2 o'clock the clutch on the chrono wheel drops to the closed position and the gear train stops. I tried moving the gears with my brass tweezer by moving the winding barrel and it is like the gear train is bound up. If I bump it back and forth gently I can get the gears to fee wheel a bit and sometime it will free wheel for about 3/4 turn and I can see the Chrono second hand pinion moving on the other side the main plate but then binds up again. I did oil the second hand pinion as described in the tech guide before inserting it into the center wheel pinion and it did not look to be bent as it dropped in.

I suspect a bad chrono wheel. The one thing I did was ultrasonic clean the chrono wheel in lighter fluid and maybe that was my error. Any thoughts on possible solutions outside of sourcing a new chrono wheel are appreciated. The watch worked fine when I received it so I must have done something wrong or the chrono wheel just gave up the ghost. Pretty disappointing.

Update - I just figured out my issue. On a whim I looked at the parts list for cal 7017A to get the chrono wheel part number as there are two different wheels depending on date the watch was manufactured. In the note, it stated each wheel is combined with a certain center wheel bridge and mainspring barrel. Recall, I swapped in a barrel and spring for a cal 7016 which I thought was the same except for the barrel arbor. I think the 7016 barrel is slight taller on center as I noted a spacer used on cal 7016 just below the chrono bridge. I did use a set of calipers to measure the barrel width and height at outer ends but not on center other than to note the barrel arbors were different heights.

Next, I loosened the upper train bridge screws slightly on the side near the mainspring barrel and voila, the chrono wheel works with clutch engaged and disengaged and the gear train free wheels nicely in both setting. Tighten down on the upper train bridge screws and and same binding issue.

Back to square one. I need to pull the motion side apart, clean, and this time swap back in the old mainspring barrel. Lesson learned. Barrel assembly for cal 7016 will not work in cal 7017.





Good deduction John.

All the best with it
__________________
Paul ;-)
nzwatchdoctor is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 03-23-2019, 11:14 PM   #18 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
Vette Enthusiast's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2019
Location: NOVA
Posts: 169
Points: 6 (+)
Default

I will upload some pics in the morning. I successfully moved the new spring to the old mainspring barrel and cap on the first attempt this time. Got everything put back together and running and low and behold my numbers on full wind are 295 to 307 and bleeding off into the 260s. This is great news. The bad news is that something is still binding up the movement when I engage the chronograph. It runs for a few seconds and then comes to a halt. I have tried loosing the upper train bridge screws and no effect.

Recall in my earlier post where I was not able to free wheel the movement in chrono mode by moving the mainspring barrel with the palette and balance assembly off the movement. Movement free wheeled in standard running mode but would bind if in chrono. I can visibly see the chrono clutch in open and closed position. Open position runs, closed position binds. I loosened the upper train bridge screws above the mainspring and it freed up so I thought change back to the old mainspring barrel.

Now, if I lightly tap on the train bridge with the movement in chrono mode it will tick over a few times intermittently. I am starting to think the chrono wheel is bad. The wheel looks good on the outside but maybe something went wrong internally Any other thoughts before I try and source a new chrono wheel?

I did replace the center wheel bridge due to a broken jewel early on. It matched up perfectly to the old one visually but that is what I thought about the mainspring barrel I purchased. The first time I put the movement together it all worked but with low amplitude.
__________________
____________
--John S.--

Last edited by Vette Enthusiast; 03-24-2019 at 09:49 AM.
Vette Enthusiast is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 03-23-2019, 11:17 PM   #19 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
Grammarofdesign's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: US of A
Posts: 4,285
Points: 178 (+)
Default

Atta boy John your perseverance is paying off. Now the rest to sort and it will be better than new.



I wish I had your skill set. I love how you guys troubleshoot and stick with it.


Continued good luck !
Grammarofdesign is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 03-24-2019, 09:33 AM   #20 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
Vette Enthusiast's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2019
Location: NOVA
Posts: 169
Points: 6 (+)
Default

Sorry guys, I will post some pics soon. I think they are doing maintenance on the servers at work so none of my emails are coming through from my phone. I pulled the motion side apart for what I think is the 4th or 5th time now. I had printed off some interesting Seiko Technical Troubleshooting info on cal 7005/7006 and 6318/6319 which goes into some pretty in depth troubleshooting for certain functional failures related to chronograph running. One section talks about chrono stoppage when the start button is depressed. They focus on two things. Condition of the chronograph wheel and end shake measurement for the center wheel and chronograph pinion. Seems too little shake can result in stoppage.

Since I swapped in a new center wheel bridge, I wondered if the thickness of that bridge or the jewel depth was different than the bad one I pulled out. My micrometer reading on both bridges new and old is a hair over 18/1,000s. They look the same to me. The jewels look to be at similar depth but I have no way to measure this without a Seitz Jewel setting tool so I am reasonably sure the issue is not with the center wheel bridge. I have a new chrono wheel on order and I really hope this solves my issue. The watch runs fanatics with the chrono disengaged clutch open. Hit the start button and the balance screeches to a dead stop. Click the start button again to stop the chrono and the balance starts right back up.
__________________
____________
--John S.--
Vette Enthusiast is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 03-24-2019, 03:31 PM   #21 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
Vette Enthusiast's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2019
Location: NOVA
Posts: 169
Points: 6 (+)
Default

Finally have some photos.

Mic of old versus new center wheel bridge, new time graph numbers without the chrono running, mainspring swap, and chrono assembly drop onto chrono plate.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg IMG_0059.jpg (187.6 KB, 15 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_0060.jpg (191.3 KB, 12 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_0058.jpg (239.2 KB, 15 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_0057.jpg (143.5 KB, 13 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_0056.jpg (160.7 KB, 12 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_0055.jpg (183.1 KB, 13 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_0054.jpg (190.5 KB, 13 views)
__________________
____________
--John S.--

Last edited by Vette Enthusiast; 03-24-2019 at 03:34 PM.
Vette Enthusiast is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 03-24-2019, 05:18 PM   #22 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: Nottinghamshire
Posts: 232
Points: 6 (+)
Default

I think the 7017 is like the 7015 and only has the one register as in the seconds hand.

I'm assuming you don't have the seconds hand fitted or if it is fitted, everything is good/clear on that side? Second hand or hand tube not fouling anything?

My understanding of this sort of fault is, if everything is operating satisfactory until the chronograph function is operated (as in the clutch is closed) then the fault must either be within the second recording wheel's shaft as it passes through the centre wheel (bent shaft, burr on shaft or damage to inside of centre wheel) or as the pillar wheel is rotated and opening the balance stop lever to close the clutch could the balance stop lever be bent/misaligned and catching something, stopping the movement dead?

Hope that helps narrow the fault down.

Lee
ankrett is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 03-24-2019, 10:08 PM   #23 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
Vette Enthusiast's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2019
Location: NOVA
Posts: 169
Points: 6 (+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ankrett View Post
I think the 7017 is like the 7015 and only has the one register as in the seconds hand.

I'm assuming you don't have the seconds hand fitted or if it is fitted, everything is good/clear on that side? Second hand or hand tube not fouling anything?

My understanding of this sort of fault is, if everything is operating satisfactory until the chronograph function is operated (as in the clutch is closed) then the fault must either be within the second recording wheel's shaft as it passes through the centre wheel (bent shaft, burr on shaft or damage to inside of centre wheel) or as the pillar wheel is rotated and opening the balance stop lever to close the clutch could the balance stop lever be bent/misaligned and catching something, stopping the movement dead?

Hope that helps narrow the fault down.

Lee
Lee - Thanks. Your suggestion got me thinking about checking the chrono shaft for a possble bend but I had checked it under 10x mag and could not visibly see anything. I pulled the upper train bridge off the movement and left the chrono wheel in the run position with clutch closed. I do not have the pallet fork or balance installed. I could move the mainspring barrel very slowly and the upper part of the chrono wheel turns just fine. No resistance at all. This pretty much eliminated the possibility of a bent shaft. From what I see, the upper pinion of the chrono wheel sits in a metal pivot in the center of the upper train bridge and does not appear to be jeweled. I lubricated the upper chrono pinion as instructed. The pinion sits up a bit higher than the escape wheel pinion and 3rd wheel pinion. Recall I picked up a new center wheel bridge off a 7016 Monico. While the parts are nearly identical, I now feel the jewel itself is slightly thicker to account for the Monico's thicker movement. I checked the part numbers and the part I need is 122005 and the 7016 part is 122013. I think the slightly higher jewel is reducing the end shake on the chrono shaft and putting it in a bind when I put the upper train gear bridge in place. Note earlier when I said I could get the chrono to run a bit with the upper train bridge screws loose on one side. I am almost certain this is what is going on. Now I need to locate a new center wheel bridge or have my old one re-jeweled.
__________________
____________
--John S.--
Vette Enthusiast is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 03-29-2019, 08:22 PM   #24 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
CombatID's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: South Jersey
Posts: 444
Points: 34 (+)
Default

Iím following this and am really impressed with what you are doing John. Thank you for posting and taking the time to take the pictures. I feel your challenges as I learn so much. The 7017 fascinates me.

VTA has recently restored my 7017-6020 and when I went through all the operations the flyback function didnít work when the second hand was between 20 and 35 secs. It would stall and I would have to wait until it got past 35 secs before I could get it working again. So I sent it back to Adrian and he did a partial tear-down and hasnít seen this issue before. The heart cam (my term I think) might have a little flat spot. Adrian is still looking at it.

I guess my point is that I understand these Daini chronos are really persnickety. But once you get them right they are awesome. Keep the faith!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
__________________
Collector of Seiko, Citizen, Bulova, Hamilton...
"What do you care about what other people think" - Richard P. Feynman
Philippians 4:8 - Finally, brethren, whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is right, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is of good repute, if there is any excellence and if anything worthy of praise, dwell on these things.
CombatID is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 03-30-2019, 06:32 PM   #25 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
Vette Enthusiast's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2019
Location: NOVA
Posts: 169
Points: 6 (+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by CombatID View Post
Iím following this and am really impressed with what you are doing John. Thank you for posting and taking the time to take the pictures. I feel your challenges as I learn so much. The 7017 fascinates me.

VTA has recently restored my 7017-6020 and when I went through all the operations the flyback function didnít work when the second hand was between 20 and 35 secs. It would stall and I would have to wait until it got past 35 secs before I could get it working again. So I sent it back to Adrian and he did a partial tear-down and hasnít seen this issue before. The heart cam (my term I think) might have a little flat spot. Adrian is still looking at it.

I guess my point is that I understand these Daini chronos are really persnickety. But once you get them right they are awesome. Keep the faith!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Thank you sir. I am in the process of getting the jewel repaired on my original center wheel bridge. As soon as I have that in hand, the watch is ready to go back together for hopefully the last time. Will keep you all posted.
__________________
____________
--John S.--
Vette Enthusiast is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the Seiko & Citizen Watch Forum Ė Japanese Watch Reviews, Discussion & Trading forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
FS: NOS Seiko 5 Sports 7017-6010 Water70Proof Speedtimer from 1970 - $800 BigV86 SEIKO & CITIZEN TRADING POST 4 10-28-2016 04:59 PM
FS: Seiko5Sports SpeedTimer 6139-6010 PROOF/PROOF Ě265 thickman808 SEIKO & CITIZEN TRADING POST 4 05-26-2014 04:50 PM
Seiko 6139-6030 Speedtimer April 1970 proof/proof/notch .. rare! Ě245 inc shippingin croolis SEIKO & CITIZEN TRADING POST 0 11-17-2013 07:05 PM
FS: Seiko 6139-6030 Speedtimer, Apr 1970 proof/proof + notch case - Ě200 shipped croolis SEIKO & CITIZEN TRADING POST 0 11-02-2013 01:26 PM
SOLD: Seiko 6139-6010 JDM 70m Proof Speedtimer, black dial, original $155 Spencer PK SEIKO & CITIZEN TRADING POST 0 11-09-2011 09:39 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 12:32 AM.



Powered by vBulletin® Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
SEO by vBSEO 3.6.1
vBulletin Security provided by vBSecurity v2.2.2 (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2019 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.