'Do it yourself Sinn UX' - Page 2 - Seiko & Citizen Watch Forum – Japanese Watch Reviews, Discussion & Trading
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Old 10-22-2010, 05:40 AM   #26 (permalink)
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Default Re: 'Do it yourself Sinn UX'

Quote:
Originally Posted by kai_h
No, but it's a clear liquid with similar optical properties...
Data sheets for the Fluorinert coolant fluids are available from 3M and you have links to them also on the page that I linked to above. The data sheets don't provide optical properties information but since these fluids are 1.8 x as dense as water, I doubt that they have similar optical properties. In particular if they absorb UV they will absorb most of the energy available in sunlight.
Cheers,
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Old 10-22-2010, 08:55 AM   #27 (permalink)
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Default Re: 'Do it yourself Sinn UX'

Quote:
Originally Posted by Catalin
I don't know if that link was posted here:

http://www.christopherwardforum.com/...t=4960&start=0

Because of that now I am tempted to find a second-hand SBCM025 and see how it looks liquid-filled !!!

A few quick notes (barely more technical):

- I don't see that as something to be done 'home by everybody', but obviously for a small mod shop which would expect to mod in that way 100-200 watches/year the costs might be quite OK - the volume used for a single watch is probably very small; and once you get over 1000 watches or so (like for a real production, even for a more limited edition) the costs really don't matter;

- the mod on a watch/case which was not specifically designed to be filled with liquid will most likely NOT (significantly) increase the WR of the watch - the big gain would be on visibility, and specifically visibility under water;

- given the above point - the talk on compensating thermal expansion (and patenting that) is still very interesting but not something to worry about - placing inside the liquid something made of rubber (or similar) and with a volume big enough to cover thermal expansion from let's say 20C to 60C would most likely fix the immediate problems (except if you want to build a WR 10000m watch);

- depending on the ideal wavelength for specific solar cells used vs. the wavelength transmission of the specific liquid used I would say it's a chance of over 90% that the mod might work perfectly fine with solar watches.
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Old 10-22-2010, 09:45 AM   #28 (permalink)
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Default Re: 'Do it yourself Sinn UX'

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Originally Posted by aladin_sane
I wonder how he is handling the fluid expansion. I would guess some sort of compressible foam ring for a movement holder. It is a pretty cool concept.
Hi,
Foam compresses because it contains hollow cavities filled with air. Putting a foam piece inside a liquid will just result in the formation of a bubble when the air inside the cavities is replaced by the liquid. I am very much guessing even closed cell type foam will over time get completely "soaked" with Fluorinert.
The Sinn UX has a specially designed complex case back with a piston to account for the expansion/contraction of the fluid. I confess I don't see what other kind of simple solution one can use to solve this issue, but most probably foam or other porous materials are not one, imo. Certainly if the author of the article has found a solution he should patent it.
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Old 10-22-2010, 10:56 AM   #29 (permalink)
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Default Re: 'Do it yourself Sinn UX'

Interesting post and link, reminds me of the submerged computer motherboard/power supply etc into an oil filled case...........

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PtufuXLvOok
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Old 10-22-2010, 11:28 AM   #30 (permalink)
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Default Re: 'Do it yourself Sinn UX'

If you check some of the G-shock forums you'll find a few guys have been doing it to their G's for awhile now. It does seem to give the watch a slightly different appearance as well as (theoretically) a much greater depth rating since the oil is much less compressible than air. But yes, for quartz only since a mechanical escapement wouldn't run through the oil.
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Old 10-22-2010, 11:52 AM   #31 (permalink)
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Default Re: 'Do it yourself Sinn UX'

Quote:
Originally Posted by ADB
Hi,
Foam compresses because it contains hollow cavities filled with air. Putting a foam piece inside a liquid will just result in the formation of a bubble when the air inside the cavities is replaced by the liquid. I am very much guessing even closed cell type foam will over time get completely "soaked" with Fluorinert.
The Sinn UX has a specially designed complex case back with a piston to account for the expansion/contraction of the fluid. I confess I don't see what other kind of simple solution one can use to solve this issue, but most probably foam or other porous materials are not one, imo. Certainly if the author of the article has found a solution he should patent it.
Cheers,
It would not be very hard to put the foam inside a rubber jacket. That would eliminate any air escape issues.
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Old 10-22-2010, 09:45 PM   #32 (permalink)
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Default Re: 'Do it yourself Sinn UX'

could not put a piece of a large rubber band in the case when it is closed? That way the ruber would compress with the pressure increase? I might be willing to try this, I have always liked the ability to see the time from any angle on the UX.
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Old 02-13-2012, 12:45 AM   #33 (permalink)
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Default Re: 'Do it yourself Sinn UX'

I picked up a cheap fossil watch on ebay just to try this... do I need it? of course not. I don't dive. I rarely even swim. I like how it makes the watch look though, and I found a much less expensive silicone oil (dielectric) that I'm going to try it with. If it works I may even test an even less expensive alternative.DOT5 brake fluid is a silicone oil and has a relatively low viscosity. It does have a very faint blue tint though.

As for the issue with thermal expansion, since it is a cheap watch I purchased to experiment with, I'm going to use a rubber diaphragm with the caseback.
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Old 02-13-2012, 01:23 AM   #34 (permalink)
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Default Re: 'Do it yourself Sinn UX'

How about heating the whole thing and then closing the case. The thermal expansion would push extra fluid out. then its actually under vacuum a little bit. One of my concern is that if the watch is heated, will the fluid inside expand enough so that it push the crystal/crown out(and it leaks)?
or if there is room, put a single bubble out of those bubble wraps.

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Old 02-13-2012, 03:00 AM   #35 (permalink)
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Default Re: 'Do it yourself Sinn UX'

Sinn U1 automatic in oil….


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Old 02-13-2012, 09:47 AM   #36 (permalink)
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Default Re: 'Do it yourself Sinn UX'

Quote:
Originally Posted by ADB
Be my guest to test it.

Cheers,
Guys have done it with solar G-Shocks and there haven't been any reports of the watches no longer being able to charge.
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Old 02-13-2012, 12:07 PM   #37 (permalink)
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Default Re: 'Do it yourself Sinn UX'

Quote:
Originally Posted by otr002
Sinn U1 automatic in oil….


[img]
Wonder if the balance on this one is a disk, rather than having arms?
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Old 02-13-2012, 12:32 PM   #38 (permalink)
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Default Re: 'Do it yourself Sinn UX'

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Originally Posted by otr002
Sinn U1 automatic in oil….
Where did you see that someone successfully used oil in a U1? I can't imagine how this would be possible unless they replaced the movement.
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Old 02-13-2012, 06:35 PM   #39 (permalink)
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Default Re: 'Do it yourself Sinn UX'

Sinn has done it……have a read on there web site
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Old 02-13-2012, 07:42 PM   #40 (permalink)
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Default Re: 'Do it yourself Sinn UX'

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Originally Posted by otr002
Sinn has done it……have a read on there web site
Do you have a link? I just spent some time searching the site, but couldn't find any mention of a hydro U1. I did see this under the Hydro Section:

"That's why every HYDRO Watch must also be a quartz watch. The oscillation of the balance in a mechanical watch cannot overcome the friction of a liquid medium."
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Old 02-13-2012, 10:19 PM   #41 (permalink)
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Default Re: 'Do it yourself Sinn UX'

http://www.sinnwatches.com.au/content/u1
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Old 02-13-2012, 10:35 PM   #42 (permalink)
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Default Re: 'Do it yourself Sinn UX'

Quote:
Originally Posted by otr002
That's just a standard U1 model 1010.010. It looks like the AU site has some text mixed up in the description. That watch is definitely not oil filled.
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Old 02-14-2012, 02:51 AM   #43 (permalink)
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Default Re: 'Do it yourself Sinn UX'

"Arh ha" said the sales man, "i'll get back to you on that"


Interestingly the UX is a Chronometer grade ETA, which has me wondering if this was the only grade movement that would work effectively in the fluid.
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Old 02-14-2012, 10:27 AM   #44 (permalink)
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Default Re: 'Do it yourself Sinn UX'

I agree with Pete. The Sinn AU site has added some UX test to the U1 page. There are no oil filled mechanical watches. None that keep time anyway.
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