Heads Up.. Fake 6138-7000 Galore - Seiko & Citizen Watch Forum – Japanese Watch Reviews, Discussion & Trading
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Old 03-03-2012, 03:57 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Default Heads Up.. Fake 6138-7000 Galore

Gentlemen, I just came back from a mini watch-meet this evening and was told that these 'mint' condition sliderule watches (affectionately referred as 'The Calculator' in this neck of the woods) have surfaced in Kuala Lumpur, purportedly from China.

If there was a previous thread/news on this, please just treat this as supplementary reading.

A watchmaker friend was shown a particular piece that looks everything like the original - including original cal 6138 movement, but minus the clear plastic thing (what do you call them anyway?).

I might get shot by the syndicate's ringleader :-\ (If you are reading this syndicate member, there is still chance to repent) for disclosing the details, but the fake versions all have the SAME S/N!

There have been several sightings so far (would have been more, but some just don't want to own up maybe because they are ashamed that they were duped in the first place) in different locations and different owners. I also saw a couple of watch related blogs offering and have sold them, just hope no one here buys something they did not intend to buy.

Heck, there's even one on ebay right now as well as a couple already sold there(from google search results).

Details:
1. Mint/NOS condition WITHOUT box or papers
2. Serial Number: 4D8364 (try and google it!!)
3. 6 o'clock subdial shows '00' instead of '60'



4. Missing plastic pointer

Please add more info if you have any.

God help us Seikoholics!

edit: These are selling for RM2000/GBP400 and up
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Old 03-03-2012, 04:10 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Default Re: Heads Up.. Fake 6138-7000 Galore

Thanks Thanapa that is scary and it is a model i have always fancied, one of the reasons because it has that plastic "thingy"
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Old 03-03-2012, 04:13 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Default Re: Heads Up.. Fake 6138-7000 Galore

Interesting buyers beware.
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Old 03-03-2012, 04:19 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Default Re: Heads Up.. Fake 6138-7000 Galore

Fascinating - this should be archived. Thanks Thanapa!



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Old 03-03-2012, 04:26 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Default Re: Heads Up.. Fake 6138-7000 Galore

There's been a few of these sold on ebay uk recently - wonder if any of those were feikos?
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Old 03-03-2012, 04:31 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Default Re: Heads Up.. Fake 6138-7000 Galore

Interesting, looks like this one on this page would be the original source for the serial number then: http://item.ocnk.net/product/746

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Old 03-03-2012, 04:33 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Default Re: Heads Up.. Fake 6138-7000 Galore

And here is a current eBay listing for a fake: http://www.ebay.com/itm/VINTAGE-OVER...#ht_941wt_1163


Very scary, the execution looks frighteningly good...
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Old 03-03-2012, 04:36 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Default Re: Heads Up.. Fake 6138-7000 Galore

[size=2em]"I have many of these watches which I shall be selling on ebay . Please earmark me and bid with confidence"

oh dear!
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Old 03-03-2012, 04:38 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Default Re: Heads Up.. Fake 6138-7000 Galore

Quote:
Originally Posted by Technoman
And here is a current eBay listing for a fake: http://www.ebay.com/itm/VINTAGE-OVER...#ht_941wt_1163


Very scary, the execution looks frighteningly good...

reported to eBay



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Old 03-03-2012, 04:41 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Default Re: Heads Up.. Fake 6138-7000 Galore

These were sold recently:

1. Dec 01, 2011 - $530 plus Shipping


2. Feb 16, 2012 - $699.99 (free shipping)



3. Same Seller Feb 02, 2012 - $520 (free shipping)


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Old 03-03-2012, 05:20 PM   #11 (permalink)
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Default Re: Heads Up.. Fake 6138-7000 Galore

Those last two appear to be Sophon_i, is that correct? Interesting that someone who has constant access to the necessary movements would be selling these....
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Old 03-03-2012, 05:28 PM   #12 (permalink)
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Default Re: Heads Up.. Fake 6138-7000 Galore

I just bought one of those from Sophon. I have asked him for a refund. Hopefully he will comply... :'(
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Old 03-03-2012, 05:36 PM   #13 (permalink)
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Default Re: Heads Up.. Fake 6138-7000 Galore

Truth be told fellas, as crappy a reputation he has, even veteran seiko collectors have bought and sold these. We need proof that these are not genuine.

They say if it walks and talks like a duck, it normally is.

Other than the caseback and dial, how do the normal casual collector prove that this isn't a 'genuine' mishmash of overstocked parts.

Or maybe they have been fabricated only recently? (The earliest one I saw online was from mid 2010).
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Old 03-03-2012, 05:40 PM   #14 (permalink)
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Default Re: Heads Up.. Fake 6138-7000 Galore

Even if they were mismatched overstock parts. They would not have the same serial number and "00" dial. I paid with Paypal, hopefully my money is safe.
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Old 03-03-2012, 05:45 PM   #15 (permalink)
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Default Re: Heads Up.. Fake 6138-7000 Galore

Hopefully, you get your money back Solaris. I was just thinking about those who didn't use paypal and bought privately.

What recourse would you have if you bought privately and the seller is adamant that it definitely is the genuine article?
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Old 03-03-2012, 05:52 PM   #16 (permalink)
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Default Re: Heads Up.. Fake 6138-7000 Galore

The real watch is a beautifull model, and this seller is not making us any favors selling this crap. Because of course he knows is a fake.

Reported to eBay as a fake.
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Old 03-03-2012, 06:07 PM   #17 (permalink)
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Default Re: Heads Up.. Fake 6138-7000 Galore

In addition to the case back and the dial, also the bezel is not the same quality as the original. I speculate that the reason why they are always represented with the rings of the slide rule disaligned is to cover their bad alignement. Also the marks on the slide rule and the red tone are easy to recognize after a short eye training...


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Old 03-03-2012, 06:36 PM   #18 (permalink)
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Default Re: Heads Up.. Fake 6138-7000 Galore

Quote:
Originally Posted by Solaris94
I just bought one of those from Sophon. I have asked him for a refund. Hopefully he will comply... :'(
Your not the only one fella!

I ways wanted one of these, it turned out bad and I got a refund off him.
The bezel was very loose sounded like bangles.
He refunded me no problem but put me off them for life.
Am sure you will get refunded so don't panic mate.
I bought mine about 8 month ago.




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Old 03-03-2012, 07:04 PM   #19 (permalink)
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Default Re: Heads Up.. Fake 6138-7000 Galore

yes, isn't it terrible when a known international reseller of watches sells fake watches, fake dials, reworked garbage, and actively works to deceive his customers. :



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Old 03-03-2012, 07:25 PM   #20 (permalink)
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Default Re: Heads Up.. Fake 6138-7000 Galore

Quote:
Originally Posted by Spencer
yes, isn't it terrible when a known international reseller of watches sells fake watches, fake dials, reworked garbage, and actively works to deceive his customers. :
Quite.

As i said, he refunded me and it worked out.
If you have something to say then say it.
Don't be shy, or Pm me ?
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Old 03-03-2012, 07:36 PM   #21 (permalink)
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Default Re: Heads Up.. Fake 6138-7000 Galore

May be a good idea to have the pics of the fake and the original posted side by side so we can all see the difference(s). Does anyone in here have pics of the original?
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Old 03-03-2012, 07:51 PM   #22 (permalink)
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Default Re: Heads Up.. Fake 6138-7000 Galore

Quote:
Originally Posted by W4watch
Quite.

As i said, he refunded me and it worked out.
If you have something to say then say it.
Don't be shy, or Pm me ?

My personal opinion would be that there is a parallel being drawn between the sellers on eBay of these fake 6138-7000's and your own auctions for Seiko's, many of which contain fake parts, yet none of which have this mentioned in their descriptions.


Being refunded when found out should not a conscience clear.....
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Old 03-03-2012, 08:09 PM   #23 (permalink)
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Default Re: Heads Up.. Fake 6138-7000 Galore

Well said AJ and Spencer. Wow...talk about pots calling kettles black.
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Old 03-03-2012, 08:17 PM   #24 (permalink)
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Default Re: Heads Up.. Fake 6138-7000 Galore

I'll admit I'm a little lost with this thread, am I right in thinking the whole watch is fake apart from the movement? or are they just the usual fake dial, hands , insert sort of thing but with a fake back (a new one on me),
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Old 03-03-2012, 09:51 PM   #25 (permalink)
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Default Re: Heads Up.. Fake 6138-7000 Galore

Quote:
Originally Posted by seikola
I'll admit I'm a little lost with this thread, am I right in thinking the whole watch is fake apart from the movement? or are they just the usual fake dial, hands , insert sort of thing but with a fake back (a new one on me),
seikola

I am not entirely certain either, but I would postulate that someone took the unique parts not already available on the black market and had those last bits re-manufactured. It is interesting, but for this watch you can already buy fake dials and also hands, bezel inserts, pushers, stems, crowns, crystals etc etc, so all you really ever needed was a case, a bezel and a supply of 6138 movements and you can pretty much cobble that all together to make it work. At $400 + a pop, it probably turns a decent profit.







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