Author Topic: The Citizen Eco-Drive Satellite Wave  (Read 4144 times)

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Offline petew

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The Citizen Eco-Drive Satellite Wave
« on: September 29, 2011, 10:48:45 PM »

 
There was a lot of buzz on the watch forums when the Citizen Satellite Wave was announced last spring at the Swiss Basel Watch Fair.
Citizen themselves fueled the buzz (and created the Appleseed nickname) with some slick videos and a cross marketing campaign
featuring the watch in a Appleseed Japanese Anime short clip promotion.  My curiousity was piqued and a long wait began.
 
While most of the buzz revolved around the watch’s satellite reception functionality, for me, this watch is all about the look.
After all, satellite reception in wristwatches is nothing new nor expensive to produce.  I regularly use a $200.00 GPS Garmin Golf
watch with significantly more satellite receiving and processing technology in it than this Citizen Appleseed.
 
Don’t get me wrong, the technology is cool, but it’s not why I bought the watch.  This one is really a fun exercise in design.
No question, this watch looks different.  The design themes revolve around the future, space, and spacecraft.  According to Citizen, the
roundness of the case evokes that of a planet, the ceramic materials represent resistance to the elements in space and the dial/handset
displays themes of both rocket propulsion systems and the continuous orbits of satellites in space.  The green colors used throughout
the case, dial and strap mimic the light of an aurora.
 

 
Citizen even created a large visual gap between the lugs and case to produce the feeling of a planet suspended in space.
The case really does in a sense, float between the lugs.
 

 
Back to the technology; the main drawback to making a watch work with satellite reception technology is power consumption.
All watches I know that function with GPS technology have notoriously low power reserves and must be recharged frequently.
For this watch, Citizen has utilized a larger cell.  As such, this watch takes a considerable amount of direct sunlight to charge.
While other eco-drive calibers charge to full in anywhere’s from 1 – 32 hours in direct sunlight, the Appleseed takes a
whopping 150 hours to reach full charge.  This watch needs power.  That said, Citizen says, if one syncs to the signal once every
other day, the watch will function for an impressive 2.5 years on a full reserve.  There is not a power save shutdown feature.
 
Syncing is probably best done manually.  Without the signal, timekeeping is specified at a very typical +-15 seconds per month.
While there is an auto sync function, the watch will only automatically search for a signal under a very specific set of
circumstances; namely:
 
-It hasn’t synced in over 72 hours.
-The time is between 6am and 6pm because...
-The watch must be directly exposed to sunlight
 
Since Citizen suggests that syncing is best done with the watch off the wrist and held out away from the body at
arms length, I’m guessing that users will probably have much greater success manually syncing every few days
rather than hoping for a successful automatic "circumstantial" sync.
 

 
A note on timekeeping: In the manual, Citizen states that "Even when this watch receives the time signal successfully, the accuracy
of the displayed time will be dependent on the reception environment and internal processing."  Die hard accuracy freaks, be
aware; you may find better absolute timekeeping in a traditional RC design.
 
The watch is large and with it's huge sapphire crystal, it has a vibe very similar to what one gets with a Campanola.  The white
lettering is on the inside of the crystal. The watch has an incredible amount of depth to it.
 

 
The watch case is a combination of DLC stainless steel and ceramics.  Green inlays circle the ceramic portion.
 

 
There really isn't a dial on this watch.  The solar cell is covered with a highly laquered lattice structure and the day and 24
hour discs are transparent.  The green coils serve absolutely no purpose other than enforcing the overall theme of the watch.
 

 
If you look closely, you'll see the aggressive bend to the hour hand as it leaves it's center disc.
 

 
The caseback is numbered.  The steel DLC clasp is a butterfly style.  Unfortunately, the strap has to be cut to be fitted.
It's going to hurt me to cut this one.
 

 

 

 
Hands are big, green and bold.  Amazingly, they are not lumed, nor is their any lume on the dial.  As busy, sparkly and distracting
as this dial is, it's actually very legible.
 


 
The watch came in a huge box.  The manual comes on a slick little micro disk.  Watch set up is very straightforward.
If you've ever set up a Citizen RC or analog Casio RC model, you'll feel right at home.
 

 

 
Reportedly, the edition of 990 is rapidly selling out.  I've heard reports from different sources stating that many stores in Japan
and the U.S. had pre sold their allotments before the watch was delivered.  I'm actually surprised.  This is not a normal looking
watch, nor is it cheap.  Apparently the quirky design has appealed to many folks; me included.
 
Specifications
Model # - CC0005-06E
Caliber – H990
Numbered Edition of 990 Watches
Functions – Time, World Time, Day, Perpetual Calendar, 24Hr Indicator
Dimensions
 Diameter 48.5mm w/o crown
 Case thickness – 20.4mm
 Lug Width - 22mm
Materials – Ceramics, DLC Stainless Steel, Sapphire Crystal
Online Manuals:
http://www.citizenwatch.com/download...90setting.html

Website:
http://citizen.jp/topics/2011/20110615.html
 

 

Offline Aurelius

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Re: The Citizen Eco-Drive Satellite Wave
« Reply #1 on: September 29, 2011, 11:03:26 PM »
Fantastic review and great pics. Thanks. :sign0098:

Offline michael

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Re: The Citizen Eco-Drive Satellite Wave
« Reply #2 on: September 30, 2011, 12:49:11 AM »
Very nice review,and informative.The watch is very beautiful,and i understand why someone would want to have one in their collection.

Offline JohnN

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Re: The Citizen Eco-Drive Satellite Wave
« Reply #3 on: September 30, 2011, 12:53:47 AM »
Fantastic review and great pics. Thanks. :sign0098:
:iagree: . Fascinating view of what will surely become a classic Citizen. I was stunned by the following statement (but as Pete said, he wasn't buying it for its autosynch feature).  Definitely a  :great:  for any Citizen loyalist with a remarkable design and design philosophy.
Quote
While there is an auto sync function, the watch will only automatically search for a signal under a very specific set of circumstances; namely:
 
-It hasn’t synced in over 72 hours.
-The time is between 6am and 6pm because...
-The watch must be directly exposed to sunlight

Offline sharkfinDave

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Re: The Citizen Eco-Drive Satellite Wave
« Reply #4 on: September 30, 2011, 01:36:23 AM »
Nice!


Congrats Petew!


Great review.


I dig it, I love quirky watches. Its so much nicer now that we can see these real life pics.
Its a shame its priced so high, but I guess its targeting the collectors out there.


As for the rubber strap, don't cut it. Use another strap instead. Its so cool. I hate to perma size a strap.

I'm surprised no lume on this one. Too bad, would've been really cool.

I guess living in a cloudy or non sunny place would be challenging to keep that charged up.


Thanks for posting.
Have fun with wearing that one. ;D
Cheers.

Offline Kraftwerck

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Re: The Citizen Eco-Drive Satellite Wave
« Reply #5 on: September 30, 2011, 07:21:10 AM »
Fantastic review of a watch unknown to me. Very interesting and informative, a pleassure to read. A odd but very nice looking watch.

Thank you.
Hernán

Offline kai_h

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Re: The Citizen Eco-Drive Satellite Wave
« Reply #6 on: September 30, 2011, 09:14:39 AM »
Wow, what an amazing watch. Design is very out there, yet manages to hold itself together quite well.
I like the idea of the satellite sync as in Melbourne, Australia it's pretty well impossible to get an RC sync - at least my Pathfinder hasn't managed to sync once.

Offline Bartleby

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Re: The Citizen Eco-Drive Satellite Wave
« Reply #7 on: September 30, 2011, 09:44:07 AM »
Fantastic to see something new and good looking.  Good review, thanks Pete.
The user formerly known as markmills

Offline brett kenny

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Re: The Citizen Eco-Drive Satellite Wave
« Reply #8 on: September 30, 2011, 01:27:44 PM »
appreciate this first look into a special watch from citizen.
 
the strap is beautiful and the tech/ materials amazing.
 
all that being said, the watch itself is quite ugly isnt it. why citizen had to overdo the design and make it the dogs breakfast it clearly is, is really hard to fathom.
 
cant wait for the future releases of more affordable sat wave citis!

Offline thewind34

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Re: The Citizen Eco-Drive Satellite Wave
« Reply #9 on: September 30, 2011, 03:32:38 PM »
Great review, Super beautiful pictures!!! :bravo_2:

Offline Time

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Re: The Citizen Eco-Drive Satellite Wave
« Reply #10 on: September 30, 2011, 03:45:11 PM »
thanks for the super review!!!
Eternus Infinitus

www.StargateWatch.com

Offline Sir Les

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Re: The Citizen Eco-Drive Satellite Wave
« Reply #11 on: September 30, 2011, 03:53:29 PM »
Nicely done, Pete -- that looks like a very difficult watch to photograph!  I don't suppose the green coils could be anything to do with the aerial, could they?
Do you realize if it weren't for Edison we'd be watching TV by candlelight?  —
Al Boliska

Offline SouthPender

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Re: The Citizen Eco-Drive Satellite Wave
« Reply #12 on: September 30, 2011, 04:16:43 PM »
Wonderful review, petew!  You've answered all the questions I had when I saw it first announced.  A very interesting watch.  Like JohnN, I too was surprised to read about its sync'ing behavior.  I had thought that perhaps satellite sync'ing would be more reliable than RC sync'ing, and perhaps more frequent (automatically) as well.  However, having sync'ing capabilities anywhere in the world is certainly an advantage for those outside the range of RC transmitters.  For those inside these ranges, though, it seems that RC is perhaps superior--really a surprise to me.  Satellite sync'ing is obviously not imperiled by the same factors as RC sync'ing (mountains, unusual topography), but I wonder what weather or atmospheric factors would block or degrade a satellite signal.
Vancouver

Offline petew

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Re: The Citizen Eco-Drive Satellite Wave
« Reply #13 on: September 30, 2011, 04:39:23 PM »
Hi Sir Les,
 
I was initially hoping that the coils were some sort of antenna but the information I've read states that the antenna is part of the movement and the coils are ornamental.  This is all through a translation but it appears to be true as I can't see a spot where their is a connection between the coils and the inside of the case.
 
Nicely done, Pete -- that looks like a very difficult watch to photograph!  I don't suppose the green coils could be anything to do with the aerial, could they?
« Last Edit: January 01, 1970, 12:00:00 AM by petew »

Offline petew

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Re: The Citizen Eco-Drive Satellite Wave
« Reply #14 on: September 30, 2011, 04:43:48 PM »
Hi SP,
 
Not sure if I conveyed it properly in the review or not, but one can manually sync to the satellite whenever they want, provided they are outside and the power reserve is adequate.  Those 3 conditional requirements I noted only affected the watch when it was trying to auto sync by itself.
 
According to the manual, you'll need a decent amount of clear sky above you without too many surrounding trees or buildings to get a signal.  I'm not sure if a signal could be grabbed during a heavy rainstorm, I'll have to test that when the conditions are appropriate.
 
 
Like JohnN, I too was surprised to read about its sync'ing behavior.  I had thought that perhaps satellite sync'ing would be more reliable than RC sync'ing, and perhaps more frequent (automatically) as well.  However, having sync'ing capabilities anywhere in the world is certainly an advantage for those outside the range of RC transmitters.  For those inside these ranges, though, it seems that RC is perhaps superior--really a surprise to me.  Satellite sync'ing is obviously not imperiled by the same factors as RC sync'ing (mountains, unusual topography), but I wonder what weather or atmospheric factors would block or degrade a satellite signal.

Offline sharkfinDave

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Re: The Citizen Eco-Drive Satellite Wave
« Reply #15 on: September 30, 2011, 06:51:58 PM »
Any wrist pics?


Lets see how it looks on the wrist?


thx.

Offline Karyo

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Re: The Citizen Eco-Drive Satellite Wave
« Reply #16 on: November 10, 2011, 09:01:12 AM »
Stuck one of my other rubber straps on mine in order to take some pics (didn't want to cut the original strap before deciding if I was going to keep it...)





I have small to medium sized wrists - it is a huge watch but wears quite easy - not toooo heavy nor tooo huge, very comfy.

Offline BlueMoon

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Re: The Citizen Eco-Drive Satellite Wave
« Reply #17 on: November 10, 2011, 10:26:20 AM »
That design looks lush  :great:

Offline GTR83

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Re: The Citizen Eco-Drive Satellite Wave
« Reply #18 on: November 10, 2011, 12:33:11 PM »
appreciate this first look into a special watch from citizen.
 
the strap is beautiful and the tech/ materials amazing.
 
all that being said, the watch itself is quite ugly isnt it. why citizen had to overdo the design and make it the dogs breakfast it clearly is, is really hard to fathom.
 
cant wait for the future releases of more affordable sat wave citis!


It is not ugly at all. :great:
People who prefer dress watches and the "clean diver" styles from Seiko may find this repulsive; but to me, it is simply a case of "it looks better in the flesh". Citizen has made a lot of watches with very busy dials so maybe I have just gotten too used to it.



Regards, G. George Naibaho

Offline Karyo

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Re: The Citizen Eco-Drive Satellite Wave
« Reply #19 on: November 10, 2011, 02:04:21 PM »
i find it doesn't actually look too busy; the whole watch is basically one big solar receptor - the complete dial looks like a single huge solar panel.
the eye does not really look at the busy sides of the dials; on the day dial one catches the side that is right side up for reading - not the back end side with the day upside down.
date is clearly visible at the bottom - one actually doesn't even see the 24h subdial at all unless one remembers to focus on it. the center dial 'complication' for receiving status is equally overlooked completely somehow.
in the flesh everything on the watch actually blends together quite nicely - the wide minute/hour hands are the only thing one sees at first glance while wearing it.
« Last Edit: November 10, 2011, 02:06:00 PM by Karyo »

Offline Edam_

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Re: The Citizen Eco-Drive Satellite Wave
« Reply #20 on: November 10, 2011, 02:38:49 PM »



 Great review , I have never seen one like that.  :bravo_2:

Offline Karyo

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Re: The Citizen Eco-Drive Satellite Wave
« Reply #21 on: November 30, 2011, 06:14:07 AM »
Just linking back across to the pics with the Citizen original strap.
Decided to keep my watch and cut the strap; http://www.thewatchsite.com/index.php/topic,25124.msg150307.html#msg150307
I also hear that Citizen Japan might be able to supply the minute/hour hand including lume - so am looking to order that and have the lumed hands put in locally.
Also ordered a carbon-fiber strap with green stitching to go with the original clasp - hope that will look good and feel nice on the skin.
« Last Edit: November 30, 2011, 06:16:13 AM by Karyo »

Offline mycroft1958

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Re: The Citizen Eco-Drive Satellite Wave
« Reply #22 on: December 21, 2011, 02:12:06 PM »
Petew, yours is one of the most comprehensive, detailed and well-illustrated (with photos) reviews on the web. I have googled and read the majority of articles on this watch that is out there.

I was offered the opportunity to acquire one of these watches and it came right after I had just paid for another. So my 1st reaction was to say no! Your review played a major part in changing my mind, so I now have no. 559. OIne thing that I noted upon receipt of the watch today is that the packaging seems to be different. As opposed to what I see in the reports so far, mine came in a square dark blue box. The case itself was made up of 2 cylindrical halfs combined to look like a car tire laid on its side. The top is a round glass window and affords a view of the watch. There is no USB manual included, instead there is a nicely printed (thick) manual with multiple languages included.

I want to also take this opportunity to address some of the concerns mentioned by others.

I have a small wrist slightly less than 6.5in. This watch with a re-sized band sits very well on my wrist. It is currently my largest at 48.5 x 20mm watch, even when compared to the Omega PloProf that I have. Perhaps it is the case-lug interface, or the pre-curved strap, but the watch is well-integrated as a whole and does not look like it is an extraneous lump on my wrist.

I have a few high end watches n with those as a benchmark, I can say that the execution of the watch construction is absolutely exemplary and virtually flawless.

I do have a problem with the priority of the aesthetic design priorities being placed over its functionality ie form over function rather than form following function. Without these design elements of the high domed crystal and the useless coiled wire and floating bezel look, the watch could very easily be at least 5mm thinner.

Another bug-bear that I have is that the various functional settings using the pushers is overly complicated. A colleague of mine said that if Apple were to have designed this interface, it would have only 1 pusher. As it is, you can almost re-program the satellite reactor core and it's geo-synchronous orbit via the watch interface! There is no way anyone will be able to remember all the different pusher combinations to set things.

On the whole, it is a beautiful watch, but would have been virtually perfect, if it had auto-location detection and time setting as well. 200m WR and an all ceramic, or ceramic DLC Ti would have been better than ceramic-DLC steel combo. And of course, the interface could do with a rethink.

Lastly, a nice layer of lume would not cost that much more and add so much more functionality! In other words, give it to Porsche Design and keep the manufacture with Citizen.

I would call it a flawed masterpiece. Report card: "could do better". Citizen missed a chance at doing it right and hitting a home run!




Update 23 Dec:
Have tried numerous times to manually perform GPS time syncs under cloud cover skies of Singapore with zero success thus far! Not once have I succeeded! My compatriot has succeeded but once only.


What's the experience out there? Is this product not ready for the market yet? Just a pretty faced "concept watch" ?
« Last Edit: December 23, 2011, 07:25:48 AM by mycroft1958 »

Offline MrMcGoo

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Re: The Citizen Eco-Drive Satellite Wave
« Reply #23 on: December 26, 2011, 04:22:46 AM »
The best way to sync the watch is to get to an open area that has the 40 degrees of open sky all the way around. Then remove the watch from your wrist and give it the command to sync and hold the watch away from your body. At night, I can leave the watch on my wrist as long as I hold my arm out. In short, the instructions from Citizen are correct. I have a Garmin GPS running watch that needs to get the open sky before it will find the sattelites it needs. I use the same spot for both when I want to connect.
 
Bill

Offline mycroft1958

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Re: The Citizen Eco-Drive Satellite Wave
« Reply #24 on: December 26, 2011, 09:13:00 AM »
Today, I stood where I usually stand, but angled the watch towards the afternoon sun. The sun today is the strongest in many days since we are in the NE monsoon season. I gave the command to sync by shouting at the watch twice (it was off my wrist); I also made some threatening gestures at it and it finally sync'd on my second attempt. So my success rate is something like 1 in 10 attempts or 10% which is crappy under the best circumstances.


If a watch fails at its primary function that supposedly makes it a special groundbreaking feature, in my book, it is not doing very well if success is difficult and only under certain narrowly qualified specific circumstances. The citizen engineers should spend less time coming out with an over the top design and focus more on making the watch work well.


Should we pay $4000 on a limited edition citizen that is likely to be superseded over the next year and has a failure rate of 90% for its feature function?
« Last Edit: December 26, 2011, 09:53:47 AM by mycroft1958 »