Author Topic: Seiko SBCM023  (Read 4724 times)

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Offline RichardC

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Seiko SBCM023
« on: October 30, 2010, 02:11:59 PM »
I've been wearing my SBCM023 for a full week now, so it's time to do a little review on how it compares to my other divers. Most of the other models are vintage, so just to be fair I've limited it to a head-to-head with my modified SKX007.




Let me begin by just listing the pro's and con's, I'll explain everything later on.

Pro’s:

  • High accuracy Quartz
  • Perpetual calendar
  • Battery
  • Drilled lugs
  • Bezel action

Con’s:

  • Bracelet uses solid links
  • Pin and collar
  • Quartz
  • Lume
  • date only

Don't care:

  • Size
  • Price


Let’s begin with the pro’s shall we?
The SBCM023 houses the 8F35 Quartz movement, a high accuracy movement rated at ± 20 seconds a year. This is achieved by using an oscillating frequency of 196 kHz instead of the more common 32 kHz. Probably the best feature of the movement, next to it's accuracy of course, is the perpetual calendar. Gone are the days of manually changing the date, it's set and forget.. and the Seiko engineers already set it for the customers. So it's basically a forget type of thing.




Last thing worth mentioning about the movement: It's powered by a lithium battery and so the battery change interval is rated at 8 years.  Mine is due in the first half of 2018.




I'm sorry I haven’t got any pictures of the movement, I'm not ready to open her up yet :)


As I look beyond the movement there is still so much to like about the watch. As it is basically a SKX diver that has been shrunken down a few millimeters, there are still obvious differences:
First of all the case has drilled lugs, this makes changing straps easier and you are less likely to damage the case as compared to non-drilled lugs.




Secondly, and this one is less obvious, the bezel action is super smooth! It's the typical 120 click uni-directional bezel as found on all the other Seiko divers but this one is so much smoother compared to the SKX.



Now let's head to the con's.

First off: the bracelet. It suits the watch from an optical view, but it's not quite as comfortable as the presidential bracelet I use on the SKX. The links are solid, whereas the presidential bracelet uses three separate links, the middle being hollow. It gives more flexibility to the bracelet as a whole. The bracelet on the SBCM023 is somewhat stiffer, yet without being uncomfortable.

Second thing worth mentioning about the bracelet is the use of the dreaded pin and collar system. It's quite a bit more difficult to size the bracelet without the right tools. And even if you have the right tools it takes quite a bit of tinkering and getting used to. I prefer the screw links in the super oyster (Wjean) or the simple push pin of the presidential bracelet. I think eventually I'll revert to a hammer by Noah, as the presidential is not available in 20 mm.




Next con is an obvious one. The SBCM023 uses a quartz movement.We all understand that the biggest pro's I summed up so far could not be achieved with a mechanical watch, but I still prefer mechanicals. As an electronics engineer I see the benefits of An electronic movement (whether it be quartz, kinetic or something other), it suits me. On the other hand, mechanicals dazzle me, quite possible because I don't really grasp the wonders of such fine craftsmanship. It's like many of you here already mentioned, mechanicals have a soul (well.. kind of).

Lume... we have to talk about lume on a diver style watch right? I find the lume on the SBCM023 to be adequate. It's easily readable all night long. And yet is not as bright as the SKX. The lume on the SBCM023 dims quick, much faster as the SKX. If I had to give a score, the SBCM023 scores a 8.5 compared to the baseline 10 of the SKX. Especially the hands are not as good as on the SKX. As I have no stock SKX it's not really a fair comparison, but my mod uses only genuine Seiko parts, so I guess it'll have to do.




Last of the con's would be that the SBCM023 is date only. I've grown accustomed to the day/date of the SKX (and older models). It's not a deal breaker, but I would like to see a day wheel on this watch, preferably a Kanji/English as it is a JDM watch.




And finally, to sum up the comparison there are two other points I would like to mention: The size of the SBCM023: it is smaller than the SKX models, I measured 38 mm as compared to 42 for the SKX. As I only have 6.5 inch wrists I can wear both models without looking funny.But I guess it could be a deal breaker if you have larger wrists.




Last is the price. I paid 220 Euros and was fined 26 euro in import duty here in The Netherlands (thanks to Katsu-San who listed the value as 100 USD). So total sum paid was 246 euro's (about 320 USD), about the same I have paid for the complete modification of my SKX. Please keep in mind your price may vary due to currency exchange and local import duties

Final verdict:
Which one is the best? Honestly, I can’t choose, there is too much to like about both watches.
My guess is the SBCM023 is going to be my daily grab-and-go watch and the SKX will remain my beater.


PS: Sorry for less than stellar photo quality. Battery of the SRL died on me, will try to take better pics later.

Offline nhoJ

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Re: Seiko SBCM023
« Reply #1 on: October 30, 2010, 02:37:07 PM »
Excellent review.  Thanks for the comparison.

Offline minidriver

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Re: Seiko SBCM023
« Reply #2 on: October 30, 2010, 08:26:45 PM »
Strange that you praise the watch for it's high accuracy and then turn around and mock it because it is quartz.

While I appreciate and own Seiko mechanicals, I do not subscribe to the belief of them having more soul or being more interesting. In fact, and since you are an engineer, you should probably have a better understanding an appreciation of a well made and fairly complex quartz movement.

I like mechanicals for what they are, but I have also outgrown their accuracy inconsistencies and the fair amount of babysitting they require to function.

Lastly, I have handled the stock bracelet in the SKX diver (Jubilee) and I think is rubbish. I'll take the solid link bracelet of the SBCM023 anyday of the week over a cheap folded/hollow link bracelet. The pin and collar system is indeed a pain in the ass but it also afford the most secure interlink system known to man. Pins and not as secure and screws have a nasty tendency to come off without warning. I had a watch with screwed links and had 2 of them partially come off for no apparent reason.


Enjoyed the review and photos.

I paid for my SBCM023 USD $285 from Higuchi and no import duty for USA residents because he ships the package EMS and then it is delivered by the United States Postal Service who has a $400 per day declared value exception.
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Offline shun

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Re: Seiko SBCM023
« Reply #3 on: October 30, 2010, 10:51:15 PM »
US$400 per day? Man.. I would have so many watches if I lived up there..  :)) :)) :))




On the watch itself: Personally, that watch does not appeal to me at all, maybe its design puts me off.. ( I dont get the appeal on the 007/009, 6309-729X... etc. )


Oh, the pin and collar system is indeed a pain in the ass, specially when you never knew it existed, and tried to adjust the bracelet by yourself ( myself, in that matter  :D  ). Thankfully, no harm was done.. I think I got lucky, and I agree to MiniDriver, it is a very reliable interlink system.

Offline minidriver

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Re: Seiko SBCM023
« Reply #4 on: October 31, 2010, 01:33:12 AM »
US$400 per day? Man.. I would have so many watches if I lived up there..  :)) :)) :))




On the watch itself: Personally, that watch does not appeal to me at all, maybe its design puts me off.. ( I dont get the appeal on the 007/009, 6309-729X... etc. )


Oh, the pin and collar system is indeed a pain in the ass, specially when you never knew it existed, and tried to adjust the bracelet by yourself ( myself, in that matter  :D  ). Thankfully, no harm was done.. I think I got lucky, and I agree to MiniDriver, it is a very reliable interlink system.




I don't think the design is beautiful or aesthetically attractive either. Just a functional "tool" watch and love the fact that you get, high accuracy, perfect seconds hand alignment (Hits every tick mark dead on), perpetual calendar and long life battery on a very affordable package with legendary Seiko quality. What's not to love? ;D
Banana Republic

Online Time

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Re: Seiko SBCM023
« Reply #5 on: October 31, 2010, 01:40:46 AM »
its too small.
 :-X
Eternus Infinitus

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Offline RichardC

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Re: Seiko SBCM023
« Reply #6 on: October 31, 2010, 08:10:17 AM »
Strange that you praise the watch for it's high accuracy and then turn around and mock it because it is quartz.

While I appreciate and own Seiko mechanicals, I do not subscribe to the belief of them having more soul or being more interesting. In fact, and since you are an engineer, you should probably have a better understanding an appreciation of a well made and fairly complex quartz movement.

I like mechanicals for what they are, but I have also outgrown their accuracy inconsistencies and the fair amount of babysitting they require to function.
We'll you are right. But as it is all personal preference, I still prefer mechanicals, but I still appreciate the movement in this watch very much.

Maybe I'm slowly turning around, lately all I buy are vintage quartz (7548/7c43).  :o


Lastly, I have handled the stock bracelet in the SKX diver (Jubilee) and I think is rubbish. I'll take the solid link bracelet of the SBCM023 anyday of the week over a cheap folded/hollow link bracelet. The pin and collar system is indeed a pain in the ass but it also afford the most secure interlink system known to man. Pins and not as secure and screws have a nasty tendency to come off without warning. I had a watch with screwed links and had 2 of them partially come off for no apparent reason.


Enjoyed the review and photos.

I paid for my SBCM023 USD $285 from Higuchi and no import duty for USA residents because he ships the package EMS and then it is delivered by the United States Postal Service who has a $400 per day declared value exception.


Again you're right, the jubilee is crap. But in the review I'm comparing it to the presidential bracelet, that is so much better.
I've also stated that I will most likely switch it for a hammer, a solid center link presidential. Just need to see if Noah has a matching endlink for the 023.


its too small.
 :-X


Not for me. I took a crappy cell phone pic of the 023 on my skinny wrist:





Offline LUW

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Re: Seiko SBCM023
« Reply #7 on: October 31, 2010, 11:18:19 AM »
its too small.
 :-X

That's why I don't have one, and have a SBQJ015 instead.
Cheers!
Luciano

Offline otherlife-san

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Re: Seiko SBCM023
« Reply #8 on: October 31, 2010, 11:54:47 AM »
Congrats, very good review! Sure you read the mine too, then I don't want to repeat all what I think about sbcm; just about the lume you said it's a "bad" point but for me
it's quite good as skx or sumo! The size is a very personal choice: my wrist is 16 cm then this diver's is perfect for me and now a skx likes too big!
Cheers,
Fred

PS: If someone knows how to remove the diver's extension of the bracelet?
« Last Edit: October 31, 2010, 12:00:48 PM by otherlife-san »

Offline RichardC

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Re: Seiko SBCM023
« Reply #9 on: October 31, 2010, 02:22:32 PM »
That's why I don't have one, and have a SBQJ015 instead.

I'd like to be able to have the SBQJ015 (or 017 for that matter). Too bad they are discontinued. For what I've seen it's a great watch!

Congrats, very good review! Sure you read the mine too, then I don't want to repeat all what I think about sbcm; just about the lume you said it's a "bad" point but for me
it's quite good as skx or sumo! The size is a very personal choice: my wrist is 16 cm then this diver's is perfect for me and now a skx likes too big!
Cheers,
Fred

PS: If someone knows how to remove the diver's extension of the bracelet?

Too be honest, you pics made me buy it :)
I was already making my mind up, but your fantastic photo's just made me order one. Thanks :)
On your question of the divers extension... I will have a look later, maybe I can figure it out.

Offline minidriver

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Re: Seiko SBCM023
« Reply #10 on: November 01, 2010, 02:09:30 PM »
That's why I don't have one, and have a SBQJ015 instead.

Not getting the Spirit 8F56 GMT when it was still widely available is definetely a regret of mine ;)
 
Seems to me the fairly underappreciated Prospex SBCM023 is also heading down the same path. As soon as Seiko discontinues it, the watch will become widely popular and hard to get second hand.
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Offline LUW

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Re: Seiko SBCM023
« Reply #11 on: November 01, 2010, 02:55:26 PM »
Without a doubt!
If anyone wants a HAQ in diver style they should get the SBCM023 right NOW.
Cheers!
Luciano

Offline ADB

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Re: Seiko SBCM023
« Reply #12 on: November 04, 2010, 11:09:42 AM »
Thanks for the nice review, and the comparison with the SKX007 is very interesting and to-the-point, since the SKX007 is such an iconic diver's in Seiko's line up (BTW if I can comment on your SKX007 mod: it looks great!).

I have both the SBCM023 and the (unmodified) SKX009 on a Z22 wave rubber strap, so I have formed my own opinion too in how they compare. In general it matches what you wrote in your review.

When I go through your list of pros, cons and don't cares, I can see we have different opinions on certain items. The first of which is price: the SBCM023, while not priced at the same extraordinarily low level as the SKX007, is still a bargain in absolute terms. In terms of quartz diver's, it is hard to beat at its present price, even with the rather unfavourable exchange rates of the Yen.

In the cons, I would have added availability, since the SKX007/009 is so much easier to buy compared to the SBCM023.

The bezel action and the lume are - at least for the two watches I own - absolutely identical when I compare the SBCM023 to the SKX009.

Finally about the SBCM023 bracelet: just like you I prefer what I call "double-hinged" oyster links, but I wasn't able to find these in any watch at the price level of the SBCM023. I have many other Seiko's and Orient's with oyster bracelets, all of them costing more than the SBCM023, and their bracelets are not as comfortable as the SBCM023 bracelet. Actually in terms of comfort on the wrist, the SBCM023 with its bracelet edges out the otherwise excellent SKX007/009 on the Seiko Z22 wave strap, even though it is around 30g heavier.

Just like you, I feel the SBCM023 is perfectly sized - and I have 7.5" wrists.

Cheers,

Andrew

Offline Webvan

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Re: Seiko SBCM023
« Reply #13 on: November 10, 2010, 12:28:02 AM »
Nice review, thanks, couple of pictures of the SBCM023 I recently picked up second hand for $200 (lucked out for once!) that I put on a Z-20 (new style apparently ?) as seen in the pics below (sorry crappy iPhone pics).

It wears quite a lot smaller than its 38mm would let you think, not sure why, thickness, bezel? Sill ok on my 7.1" wrist I'd say.

In terms of accuracy, its ok by Quartz standards, but far from what you get with a thermocompensated movement as accuracy drops significantly when you move away from normal wearing temperatures...not a problem in everyday life of course, but still...I did a comparison with the equally thermo-sensitive Bulova Precisionist : http://www.bestofwatch.com/?p=150

Since the mechanical divers were discussed above I'd heard about the Sumo but I'm now reading about the SRP043K2 and the SKX007, tempting but hard to lose the convenience of quartz, maybe if I find a good deal on an SKX007 at some point. Would be fun to have (almost) the same watch with quartz/mechanical. Apparently there is a "Super Oyster" bracelet by a guy on eBay named wjean28. Anyone think it's a good idea?  :a102:



« Last Edit: November 10, 2010, 12:31:30 AM by Webvan »

Offline RichardC

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Re: Seiko SBCM023
« Reply #14 on: November 10, 2010, 08:25:55 AM »
Apparently there is a "Super Oyster" bracelet by a guy on eBay named wjean28. Anyone think it's a good idea?  :a102:


Congrats with the 023 Webvan, enjoy it.
About the Super Oyster: I have a SO on a 7548, and it's great. But... as you have read above, I prefer the 'double-hinged' (thanks ADB :)) bracelets.
Noah sells a bracelet like this here on SCWF, search for 'hammer'.

Offline pint of brew

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Re: Seiko SBCM023
« Reply #15 on: November 10, 2010, 11:15:15 AM »
Wjean is a very well known chap, if I'm not mistaken it's him who first made and sold the solid end-links for the super oyster. Many watches wear his end-links today and it's definitely one of the better SKX bracelets out there. Note that his solid end-links do accept fat spring bars.

Offline minidriver

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Re: Seiko SBCM023
« Reply #16 on: November 10, 2010, 02:52:02 PM »
My SBCM023 has only lost 1 second since I got it in late July. ;)


And I only wear it once per week....
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Offline Webvan

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Re: Seiko SBCM023
« Reply #17 on: November 10, 2010, 09:02:27 PM »
The warm months ;-) Mine seems to be well tuned for a 50% wearing pattern. I'm now wearing it 14 hours a day to see what accuracy I get over a week.

Offline doc4

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Re: Seiko SBCM023
« Reply #18 on: November 12, 2010, 05:38:32 PM »
Mine just arrived.  Not being a fan of BIG watches, most divers seem a bit off-putting to me, but I'm glad Seiko makes a good, small diver.  I'm really liking this one so far. 
 
 
Without a doubt!
If anyone wants a HAQ in diver style they should get the SBCM023 right NOW.

me + SBQJ017 =  :sleepy: :-[
 
me + SBCM023 =  :great: :dance:
 
 

Offline otherlife-san

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Re: Seiko SBCM023
« Reply #19 on: November 12, 2010, 06:18:45 PM »
Hi!

from april to end of october, mine was < +1 sec, wearing 4/5 days by week.
;)!